The rules of dining

Off Topic
21

I agree on tipping, especially with delivery people. Although i’m not going to always give 20% to delivery drivers, but I will always give them some green and change at the minimum depending on price/hassle factor.

I used to do pizzas myself back in the day, and fully agree on the principle of bad tippers get crappy service next time… Everyone always remembers who they are. Gives em nick names and everything, and extra items on their food at times.

We had a guy we called “double gut”. He would order 2 pizza’s super burnt (double cooked) and also wanted them cut a special way (not pie or square but rhombus shaped pieces) He got the “cut” part of his name was changed to gut since he would always come to door near nude or fully nude and had a huge beer gut. Disgusting man.
Anyway, he would only tip the “change”, meaning about $.47 cents each time. Arsehole.
The store owner was always around, and insisted on never having complaints even from dicks like double gut, so whoever delivered his order always had to get it there in time and knew he was getting the whopping .47 for it. Man that sucked. Almost as bad as delivering for the mimimum security prison, which was a guaranteed change-only-at-most tip and a huge hassle of slowness.

Rambling again…lol

Anyway, with waitstaff I always give 20% or even more if they are really good, only time I go less is if they truly suxor at the job. And me and the buds tend to go to about 5 of the same places every few weeks and get very good service because of it. They always refill our pitchers in time, know which beers we like, and make sure our food is just right.

Jodgey, this is funny “DO NOT ask your waiter for your phone number, with the premise that he will be getting some ass out of the deal, only to entrap him at starbucks with an Amway sales pitch with your husband and his impish mentor bosslady.”

lolol… cant believe people actually do that to others… like anyone is going to sign up in a business after that sort of approach…lol

22

If you get bad service, and tip accordingly, then you’re probably screwed! The person waiting on you will probably think they did a good job and deserved more, and then will think you’re just a crappy tipper.

Just up the prices of the food and get rid of tipping to make it easier on everyone. A server should only get tipped if they do an extremely well job. I’m not saying don’t tip…I’m just saying how I think it should be.

Neil

23

Servers are a bunch of spoiled Prima Donnas who think that the world owes them something.

[Whistle “Hi-ho, Hi-ho it’s off to work we go…” while waiting for Rummers head to deflate and that little vein in his noggin to stop throbbing…]

I started as a Busboy at Tony Roma’s when I was 22 years old (second restaurant job) and ended as the General Manager. All told I have 13 years in the business so I am going to suggest that I just might have something to offer here…

If you can’t afford to tip (and you live in a country where tipping IS THE CUSTOM, do not go out). In many countries the service staff make better wages from the restaurant (upwards of $10+per hour). You may think that you are “saving” the tip but don’t you think that the extra wage cost is going to be passed on to you via a $18.99 Steak costing $22.99? Of course it will! AND you will not decide what the server gets, even if he sucks ass, forgets your drinks, fucks up your order, does not maintain your table and makes you hang so long waiting for the check AND waiting for the payment to be processed that you are late for the beginning of the movie and now you have no idea just exactly WHY the Little Mermaid is under the sea anyway and just HOW DID the little Crab Guy learn to talk…

Now you gotta buy the DVD to find out. See, the server STILL gets the hourly wage.

All you get are questions.

The person serving you today will be educating your kid tomorrow.

or…

Filling their teeth.

Treating their Ghonnoreha.

Defending them in court.

Giving them Financial advice.

Maybe even rescuing them from a Fire or Accident.

Worse yet for you (if you are one of those pricks who treat the “help” poorly) flying (and hopefully LANDING!) your plane when you go on vacation.

Remember that at typical serving/carrying height your dinner is never further than 6-8" from their penis (you do not want to know what I have stopped from happening. Come to think of it, I don’t want to know what I didn’t…)…ick…

Little pissed me off at work but some tool out to impress his dinner date by treating my staff poorly then acting like mister nice guy when I approached always did.

Always.

It is very rare that a Manager will stand up for his staff, I wish more would. All bullies need to be ass-raped and stepping on some impotent spooge-licker for one of my staff never failed to make my day. The prick will affect your business once or twice a year, your staff affect it every day…who do you want to be happy?

As far as Breast-Feeding at the table I would think that a woman would know that if I had any interest in seeing her tits, I most likely would have been the one who impregnated her, I never understood the overtly proud Breast-Feeder (“Hey look!, Hey look!, They work!, they do, they do!”)…go to a secluded area or restroom. I am very proud of 'Cake Jr but you don’t see me waving him around in public trying to reap some strange public acclamation for having genetic “gear” that works and no, the “it’s a natural, beautiful thing and nothing to be ashamed about” argument is a non-issue. Passing gas is natural too but I always, ALWAYS have the decency to blame it on the dog.

I was a Manager for 3 years until I took home the same cake that I did as a server, there is lots of money to be made if you are committed to kicking ass and working hard, dragging food to the table and printing a bill deserves nothing but for those who “work” your table? you owe them something and that “something” should start at 15% and get bigger. A non-monetary benefit that servers enjoy is if you try to be the best customer you can be…polite, attentive, clean…maybe laugh at a few of their crappy jokes…strange but sometimes servers actually LIKE the people they serve. Sure makes a 12% tip much more bearable…

All of these considerations aside, after about 4-5 years MOST servers become Bitter, People-hating, Money-focused, Superficial, Miserable people. This is entirely due to serving the public who are mostly made up of people who unfortunately mostly suck.

If it wasn’t for hating everyone I saw from the moment I woke up in the morning, I would still be in the business.

But I’m better now.

Honest.

“They serve you your importance”

~ Mark Stevens

24

Only drawback of that neil is less ability for you to voice “complaints” through the pay process.

Also from what I recall about being in the business, the waitstaff themselves were against doing that with pay since they would earn less that way (especially at the mid to higher end places).

Of course business owner’s were against it since it would further show a gap in costs between the lower end restaurants and the fast food/tipless types of places…

25

I’ve always used 15% as the starting point. If you’re average (meaning I don’t wait half an hour for you to take my order, you don’t screw my order up and come back at least once to ask about more drinks) then you get 15%. If you suck you go down from there - rapidly (I’ve been known to leave the .99 tip before). Good service gets 20%, exceptional a little bit more.

26

Let me first say I’ve worked food service plenty, and agree with every point made about being a good tipper, etc etc.
However, don’t forget…it’s a gratuity. I don’t think one has any right to expect a certain amount. Sure, it sucks ass getting a cheap tip…but that’s why it’s a tip and not a cover charge.
And I will totally defend breastfeeding in public. Please. You’ve got women with their asses hanging out of their pants and their shirts so low they’re falling out…and you’re going to pick on some woman who is deciding to use her body as she pleases? Americans are so two faced about sexuality. It’s okay if you’d want to hit it, but not if it’s being used for what it was intended? If you’re going to support a woman’s right to choose, damn well support her right to raise her children as she pleases. And sorry if I ruffle any feathers there ;)I was raised homeschooled, home-grown and breast-fed, so it’s my slant.

27

Cupcake, I wish there were managers like you. Like you said, every manager I’ve ever had would gladly take me out at the knees rather than say no to a customer. Boom, instant dick created. This dick will now go into any establishment stepping all over the employees knowing he can treat people like shit and still get his way. I remember standing up to a customer in front of my fellow employees, they all froze and stared at the ground. It’s a sad state of affairs really, seems noone has a spine anymore. The customer is rarely right.

28

I was a busboy at 2 different restaurants, and boy am I glad sure I got out of that fucking business. I got paid $6.50/hr at my first one, PLUS tips, so all in all, I probably made $9/hour. The 2nd job was at TGIFridays, and they paid like $3.50/hour. Total difference.

I do agree that most servers become superficial pricks after awhile. I’ve seen it myself. If they don’t get a good tip, they get pissy for the rest of the night. I just want to say “If you don’t like it, get a different fucking job”.

Rumbach, I should say that to you. If you don’t like it, get a different fucking job. There’s so much else out there to do man. Go work at a fitness center or landscaping company or whatnot. I’m sure as hell glad I did it.

29

I would add a few rules for deliveries:

  1. Have your check/cash ready. Many times the delivery driver has other deliveries to take, and can’t afford the time it takes you to find a pen, then go find your checkbook, etc.

  2. Don’t make the delivery drivers sit there and wait while you check the order. Even if something is wrong/missing, the store will probably send someone else (someone already there) to take it to you.

3)If your using big bills, let them know when you order, drivers don’t usually carry enough to change any bill over a 50.

  1. Dont’ be one of these people who calls to order, not knowing anythign about the menu, pricing etc. Delivery phone lines are busy and they don’t have time to go over everything on the menu.
30

Most women I know who breastfed didn’t flaunt anything. They generally pick a secluded spot like in a booth away from the aisle and you’d have to really be looking to catch any more of a view than the average scoop necked blouse shows.

Going to the restroom to do things like breast feed a kid or inject insulin for a diabetic has one major drawback…IT"S A FUCKING BATHROOM! Would you eat your lunch in the shitter? How about puncture your skin, which is generally done in as clean a setting as possible, in a public restroom? Gee, that makes sense. Because we are squeamish we should make others risk disease for our comfort. How unselfish of us…NOT!

31

“go to a secluded area or…”

Yeah, the bathroom sucks and yes MOST women do not “flaunt” it, I thought we were talking about those that do not practice discretion…weren’t we?

“If you’re going to support a woman’s right to choose, damn well support her right to raise her children as she pleases. And sorry if I ruffle any feathers there ;)I was raised homeschooled, home-grown and breast-fed, so it’s my slant.”

Hey, when the kids INSIDE YOUR BODY do what you want but when it is INSIDE MY RESTAURANT and right beside my CANOLLI I think there might be something to this “democracy” thing I keep hearing about. I am in favour of breast feeding and as a matter of fact if I got to choose just how my protein shakes were dispensed, college chicks would never have to serve tables again!

But as my 4th grade teacher, Mrs Graph always said “If you didn’t bring enough to share…”

Come to think of it, she was large chested too…

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm…Large Chested…guuurrggggggllllllllllllll

“My mother never breast-fed me. She told me she liked me as a friend”

~ Rodney Dangerfield

32

I wrote this earlier but it didnt post so i will post it again although there have been many replies since i first wrote this, i hope it is not too reduntant.

Rumbach,

I really doubt that iscariot is rude or a tight wod… as he said “Cultural
difference is a strange thing”… Please understand that tipping IS NOT
EXPECTED AT ALL in aus or nz…

it was very clear from iscariots post that he was from a regoin were tipping was not common “virtually non existant” i think was his term, and the cultural difference statement should have been enough to tip you off but apparently it was not

in queensland you would not be getting 2.90 you would be getting atleast 10…
When i was 18 i was on minimum wage at just under 12 dollars… barstaff over
20years of age working at night would be getting more like 16 dollars an
hour…i think

ive waited tables and when someone leaves you a 2 dollar tip you think to
yourself: WOW i got me a tip!!!

The idea of tipping just doesnt really make sence to us (staff here do get a
desent wage)

infact if a total comes to 59.20 and the patron pays with $60 leaving the
80 cents as a tip it would be considered out of the ordinary…

since i first typed this and it did not post, i have read that you said you were having a bad week… sorry to here it, hope it gets better :slight_smile:

33

Now I now why I got really hacky looks in Boston when I never tipped, didn’t realise it was compulsory!

Rumbach are you serious about the wage being 2 dollars an hour? that is one shit wage, don’t you have a minimum wage in america, here in england the minmum wage is ?5 ~$8, can’t believe the difference.

Better tip next time I come out. But what do you do if the service is really shit! (apart from complain)

34

Tipping is not required, but it should be done. Starting at 20%? show me something out of the ordinary. 30 years in the biz, so the experience is there. why do I say “out of the ordinary”? Service in the service industry out and out sucks today. Appearance, table presentation (server and the table itself), promptness, product knowledge, all are the game, not part. I tip more on a percentage basis for the girl hustling at breakfast than I do the four stop jock. Why in the hell would I give more to a bartender who points and barks, for 1 round, coming to $15 or so, than the breakfast waitress/waiter, who hustles, greets, takes order,knows the options,fills coffee, handles 5 other tables, all with flawless execution?? And to those who expect more BECAUSE they are huge tippers, it is theft in most cases. Bartenders who slide a few to this guy, because he tips big, are stealing, plain and simple.

35

Actually everyone has a point. the tip is NOT assumed. However, good service should not be met with a smile and a ‘couple bucks thrown at the salt shaker’.
Restaraunts get away with paying their employees $2.17 and hour, even though minimum wage is $6.25 or something. AND. . . the government has been cracking down on servers who dont claim all of their tips. not the corperations who go on 20/20 proclaiming that they dont believe in taxes and havent paid them in 20 years. so, that makes the server claim ALL of their tips and earn even LESS out of their paycheck. My typical pacheck, from the restaraunt for a week (not including tips) was more of a joke than anything. Some weeks it would be like 8 dollars. full time job. $8.
NOW, to counter that point. If the waiting is a piece of shit (And many of them are. remember, you arent pulling from the top of the fulfilled potential pool here) you have every right to stiff them. Ill leave a dollar and write a note on the bill if it seems like the server is ignoring us. and I see him/her bullshitting with someone else or going on smoke break. Just remember that if you are waiting for your water with lemon, the server may have 7 other tables because the other server who was supposed to show got arrested for cocaine trafficking AGAIN.

Also, if you did recieve poor service, or are in the middle of recieving poor service. Ask to speak to a manager. Tell him that you feel the waiter may too be overloaded to handle your table and ask to be moved to another section. Your service will pick up immediately and you may get a free meal out of it.
BUT stiffing the server without letting him/her know you had bad service just makes him/her think you are a cheap piece of shit who doesnt fully understand the concept of tipping.
and the couple bucks rule just doesnt fly.

36

My tipping is a little strange. I use 15% as a starting point. That’s if nothing goes terribly wrong. It there’s anything positive at all (there usually is), the tip goes higher.

The tip is also affected by the party I’m with. If I’m by myself, the tipping percentage is usually pretty damn high. No matter what I paid for a meal by myself, I find it hard to leave less than $3-5. I have no problem with leaving 100% tips at Waffle House. My reasoning is that they work just about as hard for me there by myself as they would for a date and me. My base tipping percentage approaches 15% (or 18%, if the gratuity is already added in) as the party gets larger, though.

To live in America and not tip well is classless.

One thing I’ve thought about doing that would be funny is to leave a written account of your tipping breakdown on the check. Start out by writing down 15% or whatever, and then write down a -1% with explanation for every bad thing they did and a +1% for every good thing they did.

37

I honestly don’t get why people would want things so complicated just to voice their opinion. If they really want to voice their opinion, then they need to talk to someone about it, not just tip poorly. If you tip poorly, people just think you’re cheap, not that there was bad service. Even if you leave a note to the server, they could just blow it off thinking they did a good job and that you were just cheap.

So if you talk to a manager, then he’ll know that there is a problem and should fix it. That’s how it should be.

Tips should NOT be expected for doing one’s job, only if they did it extremely well. The restaurants should just give them a real salary. It might actually help improve service because of the reasons mentioned above.

Some people might not know that waiters can get less than minimum wage, so maybe you can’t blame them for the stupid restaurant being cheap. They should know, however.

I just think the whole thing is goofy. I also might add that if you don’t like the job, get another one. A cop is there to serve the public, but they don’t get tips. I don’t hear them complaining about not getting tips.

Neil

38

Wow, Rumbach… should have worked at the Indiana Memorial Union like I have been :slight_smile:

I bartend for a catering company and it pays fairly decent - for a college student. Its a good deal, as I’m guaranteed customers and make $7.50 an hour plus tips (which vary depending on the type of function). Sometimes Bartenders make an absolute steal and I’m happy about that because our hours are shit in terms of quantity and quality, and we are expected to know many many many different drinks on demand and do them fast and properly (if your bartender has to look it up in a Mr. Bostons or other type of book, chances are your drink isn’t tip-worthy). And I take pride in being able to mix any number of drinks very well - to me its like being a chemist or a chef - the right touch makes a big difference. I’m thrilled when I’m tipped well for that effort, considering some people are getting paid more to put things away in a filing cabinet in alphabetical order and sit in a chair all day.

JP Dubya - is it stealing? Do you know what the profit is like on a 1.5 bottle of Merlot that the company buys for about 1/4 of what it sells it for? Do you know how much they charge at an event just for HAVING a bar? Take a .75 or 1 liter bottle of gin. Think about how many G+T that will make. Imagine charging 3.50 for each of those. Think of how much you just made on top of the fees for having a bar (which will cost you roughly 7.50 an hour to have set up as the proprietor since your bartenders will do it, as opposed to the $300-$400 you might charge for having it there). Honestly, it is a killing of a business and it aint the bartenders making the killing off of any of it but the tips, which are based on how good the service is, here in America.

If there is overcharging, I can tell you exactly where it is… If I’m bartending a wedding, as a rule I will not charge the wedding party for drinks - this is understood as being a good practice and to some degree even encouraged by the management - afterall, they are already making usually $30 a head for a 200 person reception.

I agree, do NOT treat the waitstaff or bartenders like idiots - 3 of my fellow bartenders are doctoral candidates right now, quite a few of the waitstaff at work at masters students, theres a janitor who has a masters in fine arts and philosophy whose paintings are all over Indiana, and a lot of other people who are extremely intelligent. Quite often, moreso than the managerial staff themselves.

adam

39

My “2 cents” on tipping…In most cases the difference between 15 adn 20% is going to be only a few dollars…Next time ask yourself, is this 2 or 3 bucks really worth my jewing the waiter over? Does 3 dollars mean more to me or him/her? In alot of cases, yes you could have used that few dollars on something, but it just might make the night of a waiter who has had a bad night…It’s not going to make or break your day, but it might someone elses…

40

Wow, lot of responses - I didn’t realize my little pissy rant yesterday would cause such a stir.

Alright, so some followup questions.

First, anyone who questions whether I can get a “better job” or not with a four year degree can suck it, seriously. That has nothing to do with the issue, which is how some people treat waitstaff (or any service industry staff like shit). I’m not in it for life, but plenty of people are.

And I do have a better job, I work full time at a University - but when you pay $32,000 a year for college, loans are steep, and working 65 hours a week is sorta necessary for awhile.

Second, breastfeeding can be done in a non-obtrusive way. But Ike was completely correct, the type of restaurant I work in doesn’t afford much of this. We do have a crying room/breastfeeding room or whatever you want to call it - but in all honesty, I can’t understand why someone would bring a child to such a nice place.

Third, people who tip %15 and go up from there for good service, down for bad, no problem. As long as a good server gets %20. That’s how I feel about it. But, as someone else said, voice your complaints rather than quietly leave a shitty tip, you’ll be remembered much better around the place.

Last, I love bussing tables - most of our customers are wonderful folks who tip very well. The assholes get to me sometime.

Oh, and something I found out a couple weeks ago, Bjork tips %30. I love her. I almost dropped a fork on her.