Should I Try a Restart?? Clomid or Tamoxifen?

Pharma TRT
21

I don’t think this is conclusive for secondary hypo…you’re still likely suppressed from your HRT regimen…there is a reason that bodybuilders use PCT after steroid cycles (to restore HPTA function)…

What exactly are you guys trying to accomplish here? i.e. what is the end result of determining if you are primary or secondary? The fact of the matter is that one of the two was not able to produce adequate testosterone…you are not a spring chicken anymore mate…no offense, but at your age, I would hop on TRT and not look back…I would at least want to understand what my doctor wants to do (treat secondary with clomid on a continual basis?)

If you go for the SERM restart, many chose Nolvadex (tamoxifen) because it has less sides for some…I have no experience in this arena and my thoughts are just from what I’ve read from others…Clomid has some nasty sides for SOME men…others like it better…

Choose wisely…

22

I realize I’m not a spring chicken any more, but I don’t like feeling like I’m 80 or 90 either. That was the way I felt before testosterone.

I would like to have things working so I don’t have to supplement (replace). It’s a long shot but I think it is worth a try.

I would like opinions on using clomid vs tamoxifen. My endo said tamoxifen would not work for restarts, but reading sounds like tamoxifen works just as well as clomid with less issues (if I am reading correctly).

23

My comment about your age was not meant to imply that you should have to feel old…it did imply that you will likely not be able to maintain youthful T output without replacement…hence my opinion that I would continue HRT and not look back

So your doc gets you started again with a SERM…then what? You stop and maintain youthful T output for the rest of your long years without the need for any meds? Don’t hold your breathe…if you want to blindly follow your docs treatment plan then that’s your perogative…

If your doc is telling you that nolvwont work for a restart, he is either:
a. Clueless about other types of SERMs
B. Pushing an agenda

One may be better than the other depending on the sides and doses needed, but mechanism of action is the same…so not sure exactly what is going on in your docs brain

24

Well, after about 2 months taking clomid 50mg at bedtime and tamoxifen 20 mg am, I had my blood work redone.

FSH 13.5 H 1.6-8.0 mIU/ml
LH 11.3 H 1.5-9.3 mIU/ml
total test 543 241-827 ng/dl

I realize I shouldn’t double up on the SERMS. Funny thing is I was thinking that the SERMS were not doing there job. Could that be because estrogen is getting too high? (no labwork)

The Dr.'s plan is to continue on clomid for 6 months then retest.

25

[quote]dunnwes wrote:
Well, after about 2 months taking clomid 50mg at bedtime and tamoxifen 20 mg am, I had my blood work redone.

FSH 13.5 H 1.6-8.0 mIU/ml
LH 11.3 H 1.5-9.3 mIU/ml
total test 543 241-827 ng/dl

I realize I shouldn’t double up on the SERMS. Funny thing is I was thinking that the SERMS were not doing there job. Could that be because estrogen is getting too high? (no labwork)

The Dr.'s plan is to continue on clomid for 6 months then retest. [/quote]

Man, keep in mind that Clomid is worst than Tamoxifen from all points, except for the liver damage.I ll show why.

There are two main sites these drugs ll act, hypothalamus and pituitary. Clomid is an agonist at pituitary level and an antagonist at the hypothalamus, tamoxifen is an antagonist on both. That means Clomid and Tamoxifen will increase the hypothalamus GNRH, but Clomid will have a mild supression at the pituitary level, not enough to prevent androgen increase, but enough to desensitize the pituitay to GNRH, that means you ll need more GNRH to produce the same amount of LH and FSH and thus testoterone.

Tests have shown that Tamoxifen increase the sensitivity of the pituitary to GNRH. You can search on google using the keywords of my explanation and you ll find out all I said is true.

Serms are not candy, cancer and liver problems are consequences of prolonged use.You should have in mind that estrogens are important for libido and other things, taking SERMS can impair your libido and maybe thats why you are not feeling so good.

Once your testicle is normal, a month or two on SERMS are enough. Tamoxifen would be a better choice, the problem is tamoxifen is highly liver toxic, so I would not recommend taking this for more than two months, and if you stop the SERMS now maybe your testicle is not prepared yet and you wont be fully recovered.

You should take into consideration to do what your doctor told you with a little difference, clomid for 4 months, but the last 2 months I would go with tamoxifen only to avoid clomid pituitary desensitization and to eliminate all estrogen rebound. A liver verification must be a good choice before taking the tamoxifen.