yes 
thanks
Why is abortion focused on more than say gang murders or domestic violence related murders?
Why if original sin is real is the death of undeveloped foetusâs more worthy of condemnation than say crip on crip violence in LA?
Somehow I think it is rather cowardly to stand outside abortion clinics and heckle women that turn up in compton and heckle grape street crip members.
It is easy to heap shit on emotional and scared girls, not as easy to aggressively go after people who will come right back at you.
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
Why is abortion focused on more than say gang murders or domestic violence related murders?
Why if original sin is real is the death of undeveloped foetusâs more worthy of condemnation than say crip on crip violence in LA?
Somehow I think it is rather cowardly to stand outside abortion clinics and heckle women that turn up in compton and heckle grape street crip members.
It is easy to heap shit on emotional and scared girls, not as easy to aggressively go after people who will come right back at you.
[/quote]
I respect a couple of the points youâre making,others wellâŠpeople are scared of gangs. If gangs kill eachother,a lot of people will probably be glad,let alone feel pity. Your answer about heckling gang members is obvious,also. Donât do it? Why? They will hurt youâŠComparing the 2 things is a bit different however. Say someone wants to protest for animal rights? Do you go up to them and say,why donât you go to Columbia and tell them they are assholes for making drugs?
that being said,I donât see picketing abortion clinics as accomplishing anything much. You can see a lot of angry people,in clips on the news. Makes you look bad,IMO. I donât have answers for the abortion issue. I donât see any around the corner,either
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
Why is abortion focused on more than say gang murders or domestic violence related murders?
Why if original sin is real is the death of undeveloped foetusâs more worthy of condemnation than say crip on crip violence in LA? [/quote]
Itâs focused on gang violence more because, in general, thereâs an innocent party being executed in an abortion where as two grown adults making terrible life decisions are involved in the other. Both a travesties; however, theyâre not equivalent events.
Anyone that protests abortion should also protest gang violence, is that correct? How should they go about this protest? Should they protest outside the official bloods club house or just pick a random neighborhood?
Itâs awful cowardly to kill a person that canât defend themselves. We donât even do that to insurgents most of the time.
Also, we do focus on gang violence. We just call it murder and put people in prison when they commit it.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
Why is abortion focused on more than say gang murders or domestic violence related murders?
Why if original sin is real is the death of undeveloped foetusâs more worthy of condemnation than say crip on crip violence in LA? [/quote]
Itâs focused on gang violence more because, in general, thereâs an innocent party being executed in an abortion where as two grown adults making terrible life decisions are involved in the other. Both a travesties; however, theyâre not equivalent events.
Anyone that protests abortion should also protest gang violence, is that correct? How should they go about this protest? Should they protest outside the official bloods club house or just pick a random neighborhood?
Itâs awful cowardly to kill a person that canât defend themselves. We donât even do that to insurgents most of the time.
[/quote]
A baby is no more innocent than an adult, we are all of sin according to christianity. Which is the premise of why it is so duplicitous to heckle women at abortion clinics but not to do the same to gangbangers.
Is the answer fear of dying and going to heaven? Why would a real christian fear that?
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Also, we do focus on gang violence. We just call it murder and put people in prison when they commit it. [/quote]
This lol.
What a dumb fucking argument: âYou donât protest da gangz.â
Jesus Christ, what a limp noodle.
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
Why is abortion focused on more than say gang murders or domestic violence related murders?
Why if original sin is real is the death of undeveloped foetusâs more worthy of condemnation than say crip on crip violence in LA? [/quote]
Itâs focused on gang violence more because, in general, thereâs an innocent party being executed in an abortion where as two grown adults making terrible life decisions are involved in the other. Both a travesties; however, theyâre not equivalent events.
Anyone that protests abortion should also protest gang violence, is that correct? How should they go about this protest? Should they protest outside the official bloods club house or just pick a random neighborhood?
Itâs awful cowardly to kill a person that canât defend themselves. We donât even do that to insurgents most of the time.
[/quote]
A baby is no more innocent than an adult, we are all of sin according to christianity. Which is the premise of why it is so duplicitous to heckle women at abortion clinics but not to do the same to gangbangers.
Is the answer fear of dying and going to heaven? Why would a real christian fear that?[/quote]
Ya, an unborn baby is more innocent than a gangbanger with or without original sin. One gets to make choice and the other doesnât. Itâs that simple in my mind.
Iâve no idea why a person would heckle anyone. I for one would rather just have the law changed.
Fear is a normal human emotion God gave us. Most people, even those that believe in heaven, fear death.
Original sin =/= we are all the same level of innocent/guilty.
look. I am no christian,but let me ask you this question? You are debating this point on the internet,would you walk up to some big guy,that looked like he might hurt you and say all these things? And keep prodding til you got him to kick your butt? I think that might be a fair example. That being said,you are making a fair point about shouting,slandering,and yes hating women that are going to an abortion clinic. They arenât scary,so they can be abused.
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
Why is abortion focused on more than say gang murders or domestic violence related murders?
Why if original sin is real is the death of undeveloped foetusâs more worthy of condemnation than say crip on crip violence in LA?
Somehow I think it is rather cowardly to stand outside abortion clinics and heckle women that turn up in compton and heckle grape street crip members.
It is easy to heap shit on emotional and scared girls, not as easy to aggressively go after people who will come right back at you.
[/quote]
First, itâs more focused on because if you believe that abortion is the equivalent of murder, then it represents about 100,000x the murders in gang warfareâŠand is LEGALLY protected murder. This should not be too confusing to think about. It is âmore worthyâ because 1000s of fold more abortions occur than gang violence and also because it is currently protected by law while gang violence and domestic violence are recognized very rightly as crimes and therefore enjoy no protection. I donât see whatâs so hard about understanding this position.
If I told you that I was going to kill 10,000 people a day every day, and that some jackass over there was going to start a turf war and they would skirmish and kill say 50 people a day, which would YOU think was more worthy of attention? Obviously you would think both me and the other jackasses are evil peopleâdeservinglyâand you would probably put most of your time into trying to stop daily massacres rather than a couple druggie skirmishes wouldnât you? I think you are implying that there is hypocrisy there, and you would be wrong.
Second, you seem to be implying that pro-life people are not also active in working to eliminate gang and domestic violence and/or to counsel victims and otherwise help out. This is a false dichotomy that you are implying. It is not the case. There are many, many people and churches, and non-religious organizations that work very hard on gang violence and domestic violence, and you know that.
Third I agree that if you stand outside and heckle or berate girls going in to get abortions youâre an insensitive turd. Or maybe just really sheltered and bad at people relationshipsâŠbut either way, thatâs uncalled for. I donât know why you bring that up as it has zero to do with the ethical and moral questions regarding the act of abortion. Just because some jackasses behave poorly doesnât negate the ethical quandary.
[quote]confusion wrote:
that being said,I donât see picketing abortion clinics as accomplishing anything much. You can see a lot of angry people,in clips on the news. Makes you look bad,IMO.
[/quote]
I agree with this, or at least the general idea you are putting forth.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Original sin =/= we are all the same level of innocent/guilty. [/quote]
Do you support the death penalty for murderers? If yes do you support legislation having the death penalty for abortion? If not why not?
Also I believe for most of christianityâs existence it was argued unbaptised aborted children or children who died before baptism would not enter heaven as they were not cleansed of original sin:
From a christian defense blog itself
That second one is actually a tough question IMO
Abortion and the death penalty are two entirely different things no matter how hard the abortionist wants to make them comparable. That said:
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
Do you support the death penalty for murderers? If yes do you support legislation having the death penalty for abortion? If not why not? [/quote]
Yes, when there is indisputable evidence I am in favor of the death penalty.
[quote]
Also I believe for most of christianityâs existence it was argued unbaptised aborted children or children who died before baptism would not enter heaven as they were not cleansed of original sin: [/quote]
That has no bearing on whether I believe abortion is wrong or not.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Abortion and the death penalty are two entirely different things no matter how hard the abortionist wants to make them comparable. That said:
[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:
Do you support the death penalty for murderers? If yes do you support legislation having the death penalty for abortion? If not why not? [/quote]
Yes, when there is indisputable evidence I am in favor of the death penalty.
the last part seems like even more reason to fight abortion,if you believe it.
[quote]confusion wrote:
That second one is actually a tough question IMO[/quote]
No they are pretty easy actually, and this is where I typically break with what seems to be the majority of the pro-life movement.
a) No, the death penalty is not comparable to abortion in any way shape of form, and it is one of the least original and most lazy fallacyâs put forth by the pro-murder crowd in order to try and deflect away from the fact they support the slaughter of innocent children with blades and vacuums.
That said, Iâm not, in the slightest, a supporter of Capital Punishment. There are very, very few instances where Iâm okay with death being handed down as a sentence, and most of those are âheat of the momentâ types, where a father will catch someone raping his child or some other such thing.
If our legal system actually functioned as intended (100 guilty people let go rather than a single innocent person in prison) Iâd be able to reconcile Capital Punishment a lot better. But as is, I canât really get behind it. Iâm just not a huge fan of the State killing people, and citizens being okay with it.
b) Abortion being legal isnât the issue here. We could very well âsolveâ the abortion epidemic and not for one second change a single law on the books. So no, even if against the law, Capital Punishment isnât a very good option in my opinion.
In the end, technology is going to make this moot, and right before that happens, just like happened with Civil Rights, the democrats will swap sides and pretend it was always them that wanted to protect people. Just like Slavery and Jim Crow, this is a stain on the democrats that will somehow be spun by fucknuts to be forgotten.
Earlier in the thread I asked the OP if he acknowledged the overpopulation problem and if he had any thoughts about it. I was immediately accused of advocating a âholocaustâ of babies or something. Of course, I was suggesting nothing of the sort.
I believe itâs undeniable that weâre facing serious overpopulation problems and the trends show just how serious:
I know most conservatives deny this but Iâm an independent thinker and donât just open wide and swallow every aspect of the conservative agenda.
One thing Iâve suggested in the past is tax breaks for having more children. Why more? Because a big part of the problem is the disparity between wealthy, productive fertility rates and poor, unproductive fertility rates. Wealthy, intelligent people are having less children and the poor are the ones fueling the boom. But that wonât solve the problem of course. Itâs a very difficult issue. China actually punishes people for having more children with tax increases. Not an ideal scenario by any means but we may need to seriously consider something along those lines.
But my point here, is that pro-lifers really need to think about this and come up with some suggestions if they want to be taken seriously.
[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Earlier in the thread I asked the OP if he acknowledged the overpopulation problem and if he had any thoughts about it. I was immediately accused of advocating a âholocaustâ of babies or something. Of course, I was suggesting nothing of the sort.
I believe itâs undeniable that weâre facing serious overpopulation problems and the trends show just how serious:
I know most conservatives deny this but Iâm an independent thinker and donât just open wide and swallow every aspect of the conservative agenda.
One thing Iâve suggested in the past is tax breaks for having more children. Why more? Because a big part of the problem is the disparity between wealthy, productive fertility rates and poor, unproductive fertility rates. Wealthy, intelligent people are having less children and the poor are the ones fueling the boom. But that wonât solve the problem of course. Itâs a very difficult issue. China actually punishes people for having more children with tax increases. Not an ideal scenario by any means but we may need to seriously consider something along those lines.
But my point here, is that pro-lifers really need to think about this and come up with some suggestions if they want to be taken seriously.[/quote]
People have been crying about overpopulation being the end of the world as we know it for⊠I donât know, at least 400 something years now, right?
Iâm not particularly worried about it.
[quote]confusion wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]confusion wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]confusion wrote:
So,most christians defile the Sabbath. Most christian preacher teach tithing 10% of your earnings to the church. This is taught no where in the new testament,for the gentile christians. Is it ok to give 10% to the church? Of course! is it ok to teach that god commands it for new testament christians,no,because it is a lie. Confusion[/quote]
This is a non sequitur. Christians do not âdefileâ the Sabbath, we celebrate it on Sunday rather than Saturday.
The idea of tithing came from Genesis as well as mentioned as part of Mosaic Law. Tithing is a recommendation based on the action of Abraham and his tithing to Melchizedek. And while some Christian ministers take the idea of tithing way to far. As a Christian, it is important to tithe, but itâs not a requirement to give it all to the Church. Tithing is part of the Christian mission, to provide for the poor the help people in the various ways in which people need help as well as support for the Church.
Christians, even modern Judaism is not beholden to Mosaic Law as it was the constitution for a people and a country at a particular time and place in history. The Torah is part of our history, itâs important to know, but is not applicable in many instances. For instance, the rules for the Tent of Meeting and law regarding the Arc, are no longer applicable. There is no Arc, or Tent of Meeting hence laws regarding it are not applicable. [/quote]
I am with you. How do you define tithe? This is a leading question Pat,because if you say it is important to tithe 10% according to the the old days because it is a good thing,why not keep the sabbath too. My point is that tithing is nowhere even mentioned in the new testament which is for gentile christians. Confusion
[/quote]
Tithing isnât required, by the church. Itâs recommended, but not required. The 10% is a round number, there is no âruleâ where you have to tithe exactly 10%. You can tithe 10% less or more or nothing at all.
And tithing is mentioned in the New Testament, for instance:
âBut woe to you Pharisees! For you tithe mint and rue and every herb, and neglect justice and the love of God. These you ought to have done, without neglecting the others.
(Luke 11:42 ESV)â
But this also demonstrates a misunderstanding of the purpose of the scriptures. Itâs not merely a book of rules or commandments though they are present, but there is a lot more to it than that.
You seem solely focused on whether or not we follow the letter of the law, and hence base your judgement that Christians donât walk the talk because of such things.
This is a very superficial reading and understanding scriptures. Itâs not just about following a bunch of rules. The purpose of the scriptures overall is to facilitate a relationship with the Almighty. Part of that is adherence to commandments, but itâs far from being a religious legal document.
It seems to me that you have made a rather arbitrary judgement on what Christianity should look like and applying perceived actions as not being in line. Again, thatâs not the way this whole faith thing works. Itâs reciprocal relationship.[/quote]
Pat,I actually respect and agree with most of what youâre saying here. You and I both know however,that specific rules are pretty much taught in most christian churches. Example,baptists donât dance and many churches teach smoking and drinking are sinful. So,if we are talking about being free in christ,yes,thatâs awesome. But,churches donât let it go there and accept that. They pick and choose things from the old testament,ignore some things from the new testament and teach.it as gods way. You know what I am saying here. I am pointing out some things I donât think a lot of christians think much about,or just ignore. Are my assumptions incorrect in your opinion? Confusion
[/quote]
Yes, but those are semantical differences. They are not core theology. And yes, there are crackpot churches and people who use the scriptures to validate their âcrackpottinessâ that doesnât speak about the scriptures as it does themselves. The Bible is a multifaceted collection of books. It goes from brutal simplicity, to very deep complex nuance. The range is vast.
Trying to point out inconsistencies between some Christians behavior or supposed belief and what the scriptures say with little more than a cursory overview of the Bible doesnât really serve anybody well, including yourself.
If you really want to know, you have to pick a branch of Christianity, study their theology, at least to the point where you have a decent understanding of their core beliefs and then analyze them against the referred scriptures to do this justice.
You are merely casually observing the behaviors, presumably of more fringe movements of Christianity (as they get all the press), and basically saying that Christians are full of it and donât understand nor adhere to the scriptures. This is a misunderstanding of both scriptures and theology.