Roe v. Wade: 42 Years in the Past

[quote] pushharder:

Sometimes you need correcting.

[/quote]

My point was often not. For example, you thought I didn’t know Jewish communities existed outside of Israel in Paul’s time. Who wouldn’t know that? There were Jews in Alexandria over three centuries before Christ. I just get the impression you’re looking for things to correct. If I’m wrong about something, fine. I’m interested to know if I’m mistaken about something. I have been before and will be again. But that’s not quite what I’m talking about.

[quote]Perlenbacher15 wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Dawkins is such a smug, smarmy, arrogant little non-entity. Paired with Bill Maher, applauding themselves, building a strawman about why don’t monkeys evolve in front of us at the zoo - it’s literally stomach churning. And these creeps like Dawkins are always the first to come out with morally deviant positions on things like child molestation(harmless touching as Dawkins calls it) or late term abortion on demand, “encouraging” the elderly to submit to euthanasia - and why not? Ethics are fluid and subjective and what does anything matter anyway to a nihilist?[/quote]

He called the molestation that happened to him, harmless touching, as opposed to more appalling pedophilia, he fact you tried to twist that fact is quite messed up.[/quote]

You’re defending what Dawkins said and denouncing me for “twisting” his words? I suggest you google it and read exactly what he said word for word. Only a sick mind would say what he said.

[quote]confusion wrote:
"I can’t say as I’ve known many snakes personally, but the ones to whom I have been introduced have been conspicuous in their inability to speak. So clearly, human speech is a trait that has not survived the intervening millennia of herpetic evolution. "

There are some seriously dangerous snakes in Australia. The one’s I have seen I haven’t tried to talk to.lol[/quote]

I killed a krait in Northern Thailand, just south of the Burmese border. We were hunting frogs at night, and my Karen guide nearly stepped on him before I pointed him out. Fucker actually chased us. So I cut off his head with a machete.

I always kinda feel bad about killing snakes, but not in this case. If he had bitten Deng or me, there would be absolutely zero chance of surviving. And krait venom is a powerful neurotoxin, and we were deep in the jungle, with no cell phone (and no signal even if we did have one, days away from any hospitals.

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Well, I’m not sure about the historicity of the bible but I have commented previously about the similar themes and stories of different people’s founding myths. This is perennialists see much significance in. The deluge story for example appears in Sumerian and even Chinese mythology in very similar form.
[/quote]

Speaking of the deluge, as an Australian Christian, just how do you think all of the postdiluvian marsupials managed to find their way back home from Ararat?[/quote]

Dunno. Homing signal like pigeons and salmon?[/quote]

Oh dear. And here I was expecting a reasonable response such as “the deluge was a local event, not a global one, so there were no marsupials aboard the ark”.

Ah well. [/quote]

I’m not convinced there was an ark filled with animal pairs. I don’t know for certain but I would imagine that particular bible narrative may not be an exact, historical description of what occurred.
[/quote]

That’s better. My faith in you is restored. :wink:

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Well, I’m not sure about the historicity of the bible but I have commented previously about the similar themes and stories of different people’s founding myths. This is perennialists see much significance in. The deluge story for example appears in Sumerian and even Chinese mythology in very similar form.
[/quote]

Speaking of the deluge, as an Australian Christian, just how do you think all of the postdiluvian marsupials managed to find their way back home from Ararat?[/quote]

Dunno. Homing signal like pigeons and salmon?[/quote]

Oh dear. And here I was expecting a reasonable response such as “the deluge was a local event, not a global one, so there were no marsupials aboard the ark”.

Ah well. [/quote]

I’m not convinced there was an ark filled with animal pairs. I don’t know for certain but I would imagine that particular bible narrative may not be an exact, historical description of what occurred.
[/quote]

Far be it from me to try and convince you of the sort but maybe you’d like to look into it a bit more. You don’t strike me as a card carrying member of the Closed Mind Club.[/quote]

Well, I don’t dismiss it either. As an open minded person I allow the possibility that it may be rather accurate.

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Well, I’m not sure about the historicity of the bible but I have commented previously about the similar themes and stories of different people’s founding myths. This is perennialists see much significance in. The deluge story for example appears in Sumerian and even Chinese mythology in very similar form.
[/quote]

Speaking of the deluge, as an Australian Christian, just how do you think all of the postdiluvian marsupials managed to find their way back home from Ararat?[/quote]

Dunno. Homing signal like pigeons and salmon?[/quote]

Oh dear. And here I was expecting a reasonable response such as “the deluge was a local event, not a global one, so there were no marsupials aboard the ark”.

Ah well. [/quote]

I’m not convinced there was an ark filled with animal pairs. I don’t know for certain but I would imagine that particular bible narrative may not be an exact, historical description of what occurred.
[/quote]

That’s better. My faith in you is restored. ;)[/quote]

I’d be curious to know how many people actually believe this particular story. You’re going to have your zealots off course, but I think most people agree it’s logistically impossible.

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]confusion wrote:
"I can’t say as I’ve known many snakes personally, but the ones to whom I have been introduced have been conspicuous in their inability to speak. So clearly, human speech is a trait that has not survived the intervening millennia of herpetic evolution. "

There are some seriously dangerous snakes in Australia. The one’s I have seen I haven’t tried to talk to.lol[/quote]

I killed a krait in Northern Thailand, just south of the Burmese border. We were hunting frogs at night, and my Karen guide nearly stepped on him before I pointed him out. Fucker actually chased us. So I cut off his head with a machete.

I always kinda feel bad about killing snakes, but not in this case. If he had bitten Deng or me, there would be absolutely zero chance of surviving. And krait venom is a powerful neurotoxin, and we were deep in the jungle, with no cell phone (and no signal even if we did have one, days away from any hospitals. [/quote]

wow. That’s some scary shit!

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]confusion wrote:
"I can’t say as I’ve known many snakes personally, but the ones to whom I have been introduced have been conspicuous in their inability to speak. So clearly, human speech is a trait that has not survived the intervening millennia of herpetic evolution. "

There are some seriously dangerous snakes in Australia. The one’s I have seen I haven’t tried to talk to.lol[/quote]

I killed a krait in Northern Thailand, just south of the Burmese border. We were hunting frogs at night, and my Karen guide nearly stepped on him before I pointed him out. Fucker actually chased us. So I cut off his head with a machete.

I always kinda feel bad about killing snakes, but not in this case. If he had bitten Deng or me, there would be absolutely zero chance of surviving. And krait venom is a powerful neurotoxin, and we were deep in the jungle, with no cell phone (and no signal even if we did have one, days away from any hospitals. [/quote]

I heard kraits are attracted to body heat and have been known to curl up and fall asleep on people’s chest in bed.

I can’t imagine any reason to believe the Noahs ark story. In my mind,its part of the creation myths,etc… that cultures have. This one is in the bible so some people believe it,even tho they don’t believe any myths that aren’t in the bible

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

You’re defending what Dawkins said and denouncing me for “twisting” his words? I suggest you google it and read exactly what he said word for word. Only a sick mind would say what he said.[/quote]

Here is what he originally said:

I would watch games of squash from the gallery, waiting for the game to end so I could slip down and practise by myself. One day --I must have been about eleven – there was a master in the gallery with me. He pulled me onto his knee and put his hand inside my shorts. He did no more than have a little feel, but it was extremely disagreeable (the cremasteric reflex is not painful, but in a skin-crawling, creepy way it is almost worse than painful) as well as embarrassing. As soon as I could wriggle off his lap, I ran to tell my friends, many of whom had had the same experience with him. I don’t think he did any of us any lasting damage, but some years later he killed himself.

And this is what he said later:

[i]This paragraph, together with a subsequent statement to the Times that I would not judge that teacher by the standards of today, has been heavily criticised. These criticisms represent a misunderstanding, which I would like to clear up.

The standards of today are conditioned by our increasing familiarity with the traumatising effect that pedophile abuse can have on children, sometimes scarring them psychologically for life. Today we read, almost daily, of adults whose childhood was blighted by an uncle perhaps, or even a parent, who would day after day, week after week, year after year, sexually abuse a vulnerable child. The child would often have no escape, would not be believed if he/she told the other parent, or told a teacher. In many cases it is only now, when the abused children have reached adulthood, that these stories are coming out. To make light of their stories, even after all these years, might in some cases re-awaken the trauma of not being believed at the time when it was all happening, and when being believed would have meant so much to the child.

Only slightly less culpable than the abusers themselves are the institutions that protected them, of which the most prominent examples are to be found in the senior hierarchy of the Roman Catholic Church. This is why I personally donated £10,000 of my own money towards a fund, instigated by Christopher Hitchens and me, to build the legal case for prosecuting Pope Benedict XVI for his part (when Cardinal Ratzinger) in covering up sexual abuse of children by priests. Our initiative, for which I paid 50%, the rest being raised by Christopher Hitchens and Sam Harris, resulted in the book The Case of the Pope: Vatican accountability for human rights abuse, in which the distinguished barrister Geoffrey Robertson QC laid out the case for the prosecution should any jurisdiction in the world choose to take it up in the future.[/i]

He said;

“Mild paedophilia never did me any harm.”

Only a sick mind would say something like that. He came out with it in the midst of a massive pedophile scandal in the UK involving the BBC and many famous people.

“I am very conscious that you can’t condemn people of an earlier era by the standards of ours.”

Every bit the moral relativist. “Mild” pedophilia is “harmless” and we can’t judge it by today’s standards. A sick mind as I said.

He goes on to say:

[i]Now, given the terrible, persistent and recurrent traumas suffered by other people when abused as children, week after week, year after year, what should I have said about my own thirty seconds of nastiness back in the 1950s? Should I have lied and said it was the worst thing that ever happened to me? Should I have mendaciously sought the sympathy due to a victim who had truly been damaged for the rest of his life? Should I have named the offending teacher and called down posthumous disgrace upon his head?

No, no and no. To have done so would have been to belittle and insult those many people whose lives really were blighted and cursed, perhaps by year-upon-year of abuse by a father or other person who was deeply important in their life. To have done so would have invited the justifiably indignant response: ?How dare you make a fuss about the mere half minute of gagging unpleasantness that happened to you only once, and where the perpetrator was not your own father but a teacher who meant nothing special to you in your life. Stop playing the victim. Stop trying to upstage those who really were tragic victims in their own situations. Don?t cry wolf about your own bad experience, because it undermines those whose experience was – and remains – so much worse.?

That is why I made light of my own bad experience. To excuse pedophiliac assaults in general, or to make light of the horrific experiences of others, was a thousand miles from my intention.

I should have hoped that much was obvious. But I was perhaps presumptuous in the last sentence of the paragraph quoted above. I cannot know for certain that my companions’ experiences with the same teacher were are brief as mine, and theirs may have been recurrent where mine was not. That’s why I said only ‘I don?t think he did any of us lasting damage’. We discussed it among ourselves on many occasions, especially after his suicide, and there was indeed general agreement that his gassing himself was far more upsetting than his sexual depredations had been. If I am wrong about any particular individual; if any of my companions really was traumatised by the abuse long after it happened; if, perhaps it happened many times and amounted to more than the single disagreeable but brief fondling that I endured, I apologise.[/i]

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

“I am very conscious that you can’t condemn people of an earlier era by the standards of ours.”

Every bit the moral relativist. “Mild” pedophilia is “harmless” and we can’t judge it by today’s standards. A sick mind as I said.[/quote]

You mean like slavery?

[quote]confusion wrote:
I can’t imagine any reason to believe the Noahs ark story. In my mind,its part of the creation myths,etc… that cultures have. This one is in the bible so some people believe it,even tho they don’t believe any myths that aren’t in the bible[/quote]

It has nothing to do with creation.

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Lots of folks agree on lots of things but truth doesn’t come out of polls – just perceptions.
[/quote]

That’s true.

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

“I am very conscious that you can’t condemn people of an earlier era by the standards of ours.”

Every bit the moral relativist. “Mild” pedophilia is “harmless” and we can’t judge it by today’s standards. A sick mind as I said.[/quote]

You mean like slavery?[/quote]

No, because slavery is not a black and white issue like child molestation.