Race and Intelligence

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
41

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:

That book was shit, though the answer is no.[/quote]

Exactly. Diamond wrote a book that recycled old arguments from the old Cultural Ecology debates in academic anthropology and “disproved” a long discredited theory that no one legitimately advocates anyway - that Race determined the “winners” in the race of civilization.

And his environmental determinism is as flawed now as it was when the original theorists pressed it.

But, to reiterate - race is irrelevant to intelligence.

42

[quote]borrek wrote:
belligerent wrote:
The Egyptians were Egyptian, not black. And I’m not denigrating anybody. I’ve already stated that any given black individual can be smarter than any given white individual. It’s just a matter of averages.

Egyptians are still African.

And, your statement about knowing hundreds of smarter white people, but maybe only 10 smarter black people was very denigrating, and downright stupid. It was a pointless metric yet you tried to pretend it was some sort of revelation. I’m sure you don’t know even one black person for every 10 whites. It is so very gracious of you to say that there are statistical outliers who may reach your vaunted levels of intellect.
[/quote]

The groups aren’t that far apart and there is a huge amount of overlap. A black man doesn’t have to be a statistical outlier to be smarter than the average white man, he just has to above average on the black curve.

43

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
Mikeyali wrote:

That book was shit, though the answer is no.

Exactly. Diamond wrote a book that recycled old arguments from the old Cultural Ecology debates in academic anthropology and “disproved” a long discredited theory that no one legitimately advocates anyway - that Race determined the “winners” in the race of civilization.

And his environmental determinism is as flawed now as it was when the original theorists pressed it.

But, to reiterate - race is irrelevant to intelligence.[/quote]

I just know that you have never played Civilization I to IV.

If you have no iron or horses you are basically fucked and other civilizations will be mean to you.

44

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
I do not think your answer lies in intelligence, but education[/quote]

Precisely.

I grew up in South Africa. The reason it went to hell is because people were/are not educated properly throughout most of Africa.

When European colonized South Africa, for example, although the economy might have been better do you really think the black people that were there first were happy about it? You think they enjoyed apartheid?

White people brought religion into Africa (I’m talking about the central, western and southern parts where they have large Christian followings), where you would later have religious wars break out. They caused many of the problems we have today. Then they up and left, leaving uneducated people who don’t understand how to control these situations to rule the countries.

So was Africa really in a much better situation when it was primarily under the rule of white people?

As for race & intelligence, perhaps there may be differences but none that I’ve noticed. In my experience it’s people who are uneducated that are the cause of many problems (in South Africa at least). I went to school with kids of all races, and from the 1st grade right through to the end of high school, there was a pretty even mix of the smartest guys in school, racially.

SA will get better with time because the younger, better educated generation will eventually run the country one day and - hopefully - equality will be restored.

45

Correlation does not imply causation, you racist imbeciles!

46

[quote]orion wrote:
belligerent wrote:
orion wrote:
belligerent wrote:
borrek wrote:
Maybe Africa went to hell because the Europeans were less interested in colonizing, and more interested in scavenging resources.

…or maybe it’s because Africa has always been the most violent continent on Earth since long before a white man ever set foot there.

Hardly.

They do not hold a candle to Europe.

ALL races fight, just a matter of degree. Europeans have plenty of violence on their record. But violence has occupied a much less central position in Western civilization than in Africa.

Do you actually know Europe’s history?

When have we ever NOT waged war?

What do you think made as so good at it to conquer and dominate the rest of the word for centuries? [/quote]

The super-brains of the civilized European man compared to the savages. Also, God is on your side.

Duh!

47

[quote]lixy wrote:
orion wrote:
belligerent wrote:
orion wrote:
belligerent wrote:
borrek wrote:
Maybe Africa went to hell because the Europeans were less interested in colonizing, and more interested in scavenging resources.

…or maybe it’s because Africa has always been the most violent continent on Earth since long before a white man ever set foot there.

Hardly.

They do not hold a candle to Europe.

ALL races fight, just a matter of degree. Europeans have plenty of violence on their record. But violence has occupied a much less central position in Western civilization than in Africa.

Do you actually know Europe’s history?

When have we ever NOT waged war?

What do you think made as so good at it to conquer and dominate the rest of the word for centuries?

The super-brains of the civilized European man compared to the savages. Also, God is on your side.

Duh![/quote]

lol.

48

[quote]RSGZ wrote:
pittbulll wrote:
I do not think your answer lies in intelligence, but education

Precisely.

I grew up in South Africa. The reason it went to hell is because people were/are not educated properly throughout most of Africa.

When European colonized South Africa, for example, although the economy might have been better do you really think the black people that were there first were happy about it? You think they enjoyed apartheid?

White people brought religion into Africa (I’m talking about the central, western and southern parts where they have large Christian followings), where you would later have religious wars break out. They caused many of the problems we have today. Then they up and left, leaving uneducated people who don’t understand how to control these situations to rule the countries.

So was Africa really in a much better situation when it was primarily under the rule of white people?

As for race & intelligence, perhaps there may be differences but none that I’ve noticed. In my experience it’s people who are uneducated that are the cause of many problems (in South Africa at least). I went to school with kids of all races, and from the 1st grade right through to the end of high school, there was a pretty even mix of the smartest guys in school, racially.

SA will get better with time because the younger, better educated generation will eventually run the country one day and - hopefully - equality will be restored.[/quote]

Good post. As the capacity increases, so too will development. Obviously it’s complected, but education plays a huge role.

49

[quote]borrek wrote:
belligerent wrote:
borrek wrote:
Maybe Africa went to hell because the Europeans were less interested in colonizing, and more interested in scavenging resources.

…or maybe it’s because Africa has always been the most violent continent on Earth since long before a white man ever set foot there.

That is ridiculous. African history is no more violent than any other continent. Their current political problems are based out of poverty and have nothing to do with intelligence.

The problem with these so called studies is that things are heavily weighted by differences in education, and we all know that socio-economic status has a tremendous effect. Anyone who purports that IQ tests measure intelligence and not education is a fool.[/quote]

“Race differences show up by 3 years of age, even after matching on maternal education and other variables,” said Rushton. “Therefore they cannot be due to poor education since this has not yet begun to exert an effect. That’s why Jensen and I looked at the genetic hypothesis in detail. We examined 10 categories of evidence.”

1.The Worldwide Pattern of IQ Scores. East Asians average higher on IQ tests than Whites, both in the U. S. and in Asia, even though IQ tests were developed for use in the Euro-American culture. Around the world, the average IQ for East Asians centers around 106; for Whites, about 100; and for Blacks about 85 in the U.S. and 70 in sub-Saharan Africa.

2.Race Differences are Most Pronounced on Tests that Best Measure the General Intelligence Factor (g). Black-White differences, for example, are larger on the Backward Digit Span test than on the less g loaded Forward Digit Span test.

3.The Gene-Environment Architecture of IQ is the Same in all Races, and Race Differences are Most Pronounced on More Heritable Abilities. Studies of Black, White, and East Asian twins, for example, show the heritability of IQ is 50% or higher in all races."

From my link on page 1.

This is also why America is becoming a more ignorant nation – as the proportion of lower IQ individuals rises (more hispanics and blacks, fewer east asians and caucasians), it becomes easier for demagogues to manipulate the ignorant into voting for plunder.

Just look at any Obama Townhall ‘worship service’.

50

[quote]valiance. wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
clip11 wrote:
I want to know, realistically, if there is any link between race and intelligence. I look at the stae Africa is in, and it made me wonder. When europeans colonized it, it was actually in much better condition, and when they left, Africa went to hell. Whats anyones opinion?

There is. East Asians are the smartest, followed by Caucasians, then Black people and Hispanics.

For ex, the difference in IQ score (average) between black and white Americans has remained almost unchanged over the past century, despite improvement in living conditions for black people.

http://www.news-medical.net/news/2005/04/26/9530.aspx

You’re a moron.
[/quote]

I’d say that someone who obviously didn’t CLICK THE LINK and read what UNIVERSITY PROFS wrote in PEER-REVIEWED JOURNALS has that qualification locked up.

51

You know, I for one have never taken an IQ test. Well, now I’m damn curious and would like to see how high I can score. Anyone have a good study guide?

52

The IQ tests available on the internet are a joke, including the one Mensa provides to lure people into joining their club.

If you want a real IQ test, go to a trained psychologist. Mine consisted of a full day of testing. There are quite a few validated intelligence tests out there, which wouldn’t require an assessment that extensive. I just implemented the Numerical Reasoning and Watson-Glaser tests here at my company, and others like the Wonderlic are good instruments as well.

If you want a very rough measure, you can look at your SAT scores. There is a decent correlation between your performance on the SAT and general intelligence.

53

[quote]forlife wrote:
The IQ tests available on the internet are a joke, including the one Mensa provides to lure people into joining their club.

If you want a real IQ test, go to a trained psychologist. Mine consisted of a full day of testing. There are quite a few validated intelligence tests out there, which wouldn’t require an assessment that extensive. I just implemented the Numerical Reasoning and Watson-Glaser tests here at my company, and others like the Wonderlic are good instruments as well.

If you want a very rough measure, you can look at your SAT scores. There is a decent correlation between your performance on the SAT and general intelligence.[/quote]

What is the correlation coefficient between the two?

54

[quote]forlife wrote:
The IQ tests available on the internet are a joke, including the one Mensa provides to lure people into joining their club.

If you want a real IQ test, go to a trained psychologist. Mine consisted of a full day of testing. There are quite a few validated intelligence tests out there, which wouldn’t require an assessment that extensive. I just implemented the Numerical Reasoning and Watson-Glaser tests here at my company, and others like the Wonderlic are good instruments as well.

If you want a very rough measure, you can look at your SAT scores. There is a decent correlation between your performance on the SAT and general intelligence.[/quote]

Nah, I don’t think my SAT’s score would be a good indicator at all…

55

Not to downplay the role of education in the process of civilization but how in the world does anyone think the backwards totalitarian regimes of Africa are going to educate its people without the ability to invest in the capital infrastructure of their economies as a whole?

You guys are dreaming if you think government can effectively educate anyone. The first things that needs to be taught – after reading, writing and communicating on a basic level – is how to question authority. This doesn’t happen, as a general rule, in government mandated classrooms.

“Public education” is and always will be shite.

56

[quote]RSGZ wrote:
pittbulll wrote:
I do not think your answer lies in intelligence, but education

Precisely.

I grew up in South Africa. The reason it went to hell is because people were/are not educated properly throughout most of Africa.

When European colonized South Africa, for example, although the economy might have been better do you really think the black people that were there first were happy about it? You think they enjoyed apartheid?

[/quote]

Interesting, your family didn’t stick around to enjoy the post-apartheid utopia. Most white South Africans I meet who make these kinds of pronouncements do so from afar.

57

Public education should be dismantled. I didn’t have a single good teacher in elementary, jr. high and high school. Many of the teachers were abysmal. All political discussion was biased to the point of propaganda. The only reason I came out of school with any intelligence at all was because of how much extracurricular reading I did, and tutoring. The tutoring was expensive, and I could have just went to a private school if the government provided education credits and there was competition in that market.

58

[quote]lixy wrote:
Correlation does not imply causation, you racist imbeciles!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_Intelligence[/quote]

That article was full of liberal creationism. Oh well.

59

[quote]orion wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
Mikeyali wrote:

That book was shit, though the answer is no.

Exactly. Diamond wrote a book that recycled old arguments from the old Cultural Ecology debates in academic anthropology and “disproved” a long discredited theory that no one legitimately advocates anyway - that Race determined the “winners” in the race of civilization.

And his environmental determinism is as flawed now as it was when the original theorists pressed it.

But, to reiterate - race is irrelevant to intelligence.

I just know that you have never played Civilization I to IV.

If you have no iron or horses you are basically fucked and other civilizations will be mean to you.

[/quote]

Actually in civilization I you can discover The Wheel before you get horseback riding, which leads to chariots which have a better attack value than cavalry.

60

[quote]TBT4ver wrote:
orion wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
Mikeyali wrote:

That book was shit, though the answer is no.

Exactly. Diamond wrote a book that recycled old arguments from the old Cultural Ecology debates in academic anthropology and “disproved” a long discredited theory that no one legitimately advocates anyway - that Race determined the “winners” in the race of civilization.

And his environmental determinism is as flawed now as it was when the original theorists pressed it.

But, to reiterate - race is irrelevant to intelligence.

I just know that you have never played Civilization I to IV.

If you have no iron or horses you are basically fucked and other civilizations will be mean to you.

Actually in civilization I you can discover The Wheel before you get horseback riding, which leads to chariots which have a better attack value than cavalry.[/quote]

LOL. I need to start playing that game again.