I just sang “Swingin’ on a Star” in front of a couple hundred people two weeks ago.
I think public speaking is like getting a shot at the doctor…the thinking about it is the worst. Once you finish your first sentence you’ll calm down.
This guy’s either a troll or he just wants somebody to reassure him his drug habit is OK. (Pretty typical of addicts.) Let the thread die.
I made an attempt to read all the posts before I said anything for fear of repetition, but I couldn’t handle two pages of you trying to pick apart everything anyone says because you’re just waiting for someone to tell you your drug use is acceptable.
The simple fact about public speaking is that most other people understand that public speaking is a difficulty for others. Because of this, they often sympathize with anyone who is obviously having a hard time. You mentioned a scenario at work – as long as your content is there, you’ll be fine. Your audience is probably a lot more sympathetic (or empathetic) than you think.
You said yourself research is limited on this drug. The simple fact with drugs is that any effect your body likes is going to start a road to addiction. Drug addiction is a bigger problem than glossophobia.
[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
As somebody who used to completely freeze up when standing in front of an audience, my only advice is to get out there and do it. Start small…deliver a toast at a dinner party or something, then work your way up. I know this sounds like a tired old mantra, perhaps stamped onto a bottle of “AminoBlast 2000”, but “face your fears!”.
Has anybody ever successfully conquered a fear by pharmaceutical methods rather than facing it head on? (I’m excluding paranoid schitzophrenics and the like). A pill might help to alleviate some of the underlying anxiety involved but ultimately you have to sack up and “just do it” (agh…another mantra, sorry). [/quote]
If you read some of the above info, or look into the drug, you’d see where there is promise to do more than just cover up the incident.
[quote]
Look man, you may not have posted this looking for advice on how to deal with your fear, but you’re the one who said that “anxiety disorders cannot be cured by confronting the fear,” when in fact, behavior therapy (specifically exposure therapy) is the most effective treatment (including meds) out there. There’s much, much more evidence for it than propranolol, including for PTSD.
If that drug works for you, great. Good luck.[/quote]
That was never said, so I don’t know why you’re making a point about something different here.
[quote]skaz05 wrote:
I’m a much better speaker after I have had a couple of beers. You could try that, I know a lot of those talking heads on the news get sauced before they have to go on the air.
For me, it’s not really the fear of speaking in front of people - it’s because I HATE the sound of my voice. It sounds so weak and soft.
I used to scream in my car on my way to work/school; that will deepen your voice temporarily but you have to do it everyday for longer lasting effects.[/quote]
I’m much better at a lot of things after I have a few beers. At least it feels that way! The difference with propranolol is that it’s not ‘psychoactive’ and is not at risk for addiction quite like alcohol is.
[quote]attydeb2005 wrote:
You’re a douche…and you’re long winded…douchey long winded people usually THRIVE in the spot light. [/quote]
I bet that felt good to post. That’s probably about all it’ll do for you though
[quote]Gkhan wrote:
Maybe the name of this thread should be “uses of propranolol” to avoid confusion about discussing your public speaking fear.
[/quote]
I thought about it and agree, but as you can see no one knows it by name or anything about it. It certainly wouldnt gain this much attention. A good discussion can’t help people if no one pays attention to it, I figure
[quote]jasmincar wrote:
Propanolol is crazy, if you actively remember one of your memories and you inject it right after in the specific area where the memory is actived you stop the synthesis of protein necessary for the reconsolidation of your memory in the long term memory, that means you forget the memory you were remembering before injecting the propanolol
at least in rat
it’s crazy I tell you[/quote]
Have you done any studies yourself or studied it particularly? I’d be very interested to know
I can tell you’re somewhat naive, especially since you tihnk only world famous people use drugs for performance enhancement. Maybe you better look into what ‘ego’ actually means. Your post only seems to serve yourself, not others.
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
The less you give a fuck, the better at public speaking you are. Try that. Or just get sauced.[/quote]
To not care about my speaking would mean that I wouldnt do a good job preparing, delivering etc… It’s probably good advice for someone that is going to do a best man speech, or something occasionally. Getting sauced would mean that you don’t really care what the outcome is either, since… well I’m sure you know alcohol’s effect!
[quote]Nards wrote:
I just sang “Swingin’ on a Star” in front of a couple hundred people two weeks ago.
I think public speaking is like getting a shot at the doctor…the thinking about it is the worst. Once you finish your first sentence you’ll calm down. [/quote]
Completely true for a lot of people!
[quote]yorik wrote:
This guy’s either a troll or he just wants somebody to reassure him his drug habit is OK. (Pretty typical of addicts.) Let the thread die.[/quote]
Neither, but I’ll explain. I’ve been reading T-mag since '98 off and on, and joined the “new” T-Nation site in 2002.
I’m not a huge fan of posting in these forums, as you can see. The reason is that discussions are rarely productive, and there are many agendas at play, other then knowledge, when people post. That’s why Alpha was created I heard.
I wrote this thread to discuss the uses of this drug, giving my experience as a starting point. I believe it can be very helpful to others to intelligently discuss, which I know is a rare idea on T-mag.
I realize that some anti-drug people will post, I realize that some kids will post, and I realize some people will resist entertaining an idea, much less discussing it seriously. I know I’ll draw flak for responding to everyone’s post, and I’m sure I’ll lose interest once I’m reminded of the direction this forum has turned over the years.
Anyone that is ACTUALLY interested in discussing would know that not all drugs are habit forming, nor do they all “cover up” symptoms. This one has potential to actually cure some things. Pretty neat and worth discussing in my opinion.
It is certainly not an addictive “benzo” drug or anything like it, which is what most people here are assuming. I can’t say I didnt see it coming, since it’s newer research and treatment. I do understand plenty of people are anti-drug, and anti performance enhancement.
[quote]KidofNoise wrote:
I made an attempt to read all the posts before I said anything for fear of repetition, but I couldn’t handle two pages of you trying to pick apart everything anyone says because you’re just waiting for someone to tell you your drug use is acceptable.
The simple fact about public speaking is that most other people understand that public speaking is a difficulty for others. Because of this, they often sympathize with anyone who is obviously having a hard time. You mentioned a scenario at work – as long as your content is there, you’ll be fine. Your audience is probably a lot more sympathetic (or empathetic) than you think.
You said yourself research is limited on this drug. The simple fact with drugs is that any effect your body likes is going to start a road to addiction. Drug addiction is a bigger problem than glossophobia.[/quote]
Thanks for reading it all, and posting a mature post. its certainly appreciated. I can tell you for 100% that I am not looking for someone to approve of what goes in to my body. I’m sure you know that people do what they wish, in this manner anyway.
Research is not entirely limited on this drug, since it’s been used for hypertension for some time. Before approved by the FDA, it was tested for level of dependance, same as any other drug, whether for male pattern baldness, or fibromyalgia.
Not every drug causes dependance. There’s plenty of evidence to that point. In this particular situation, the chemical it blocks in the brain is actually boosted when people use cocaine and meth. What is promising about this drug, (I hate to repeat since you read it several times) is it’s very promising potential to heal in the long term.
I know I’ll draw flak for responding to everyone’s post, but I try not to ignore people on a thread I create. As you can see, out of the dust, there are a few people that have talked about propranolol. Hopefully some others have read up on it, and are willing to share their thoughts, if they have no experience with it. That’s all I’m looking for.
Below are some links that discuss Propranolol, PSTD, and PSTD prevention in the last two. Anyone who reads these or other info, can see that its valid to discuss- should anyone want to.
http://www.beforeyoutakethatpill.com/2009/2/Vaiva_2003_Biological-Psychiatry.pdf
http://www.neuropsychiatryreviews.com/march02/ptsd.html
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb4345/is_5_37/ai_n32104333/
Demonthrall,
I’d be willing to bet that you don’t need Propranolol. I’m sure that there are ways of learning better control of your emotions that are equal to this drug. I went through some pretty scary anxiety 4 years ago. I quit work and went on holiday for 10 months. Probably took me 18 months to get feel normal 99% of the time. I started chewing food slowly, spending time to chill out and get out into nature more. I also practiced a little Emotional Freedom Technique and Tai Chi that helped also.
I am still hopeless at public speaking, but I never considered using a drug. Toastmasters seems like a good option. I went once, but didn’t return as I clearly have a phobia. You have motivated me to return.
I am interested to see if you can overcome your fear and get of the Propranolol. Surely there is a reason you get stage fright. Can it not be addressed?
[quote]Andrew Dixon wrote:
Demonthrall,
I’d be willing to bet that you don’t need Propranolol. I’m sure that there are ways of learning better control of your emotions that are equal to this drug. I went through some pretty scary anxiety 4 years ago. I quit work and went on holiday for 10 months. Probably took me 18 months to get feel normal 99% of the time. I started chewing food slowly, spending time to chill out and get out into nature more. I also practiced a little Emotional Freedom Technique and Tai Chi that helped also.
I am still hopeless at public speaking, but I never considered using a drug. Toastmasters seems like a good option. I went once, but didn’t return as I clearly have a phobia. You have motivated me to return.
I am interested to see if you can overcome your fear and get of the Propranolol. Surely there is a reason you get stage fright. Can it not be addressed?[/quote]
Thanks for the post. This post was not meant to be about me, but the drug. I agree with you that I don’t need it. I’ve only come across it recently, and spoke weekly for a couple years at work, prior to this. Its obvious if it was a problem that I wouldnt have a job requiring so much. I have indeed spoken in the past couple of months several times without it. Doesn’t impair me when I don’t take it and speak, nor are there any signs of physical or mental withdrawl.
I do notice that I can perform better when I use it. Very similar to the way an athlete uses steroids to enhance their performance in a sport. Surely they can “not use steroids” and do just fine. The drug-free effort is valid, and I know there are plenty of people against steroids and other performance enhancing drugs.
I just remembered, by the way, that they brought this up in the movie “Bigger, Stronger, Faster” if any of you have seen it. Great movie.
Super awful thread.
In terms of bodybuilding, this would read:
Hey guys, I’m terrible at building muscle and was always scrawny as a brommstick. So here’s the cycle that put my skinny times behind me, you should definitely try it out if you’re thin and weak…
It’s a terrible path you’re walking upon so determined.
shit. there’s a chemically-induced-easy-way-out for everything these days.
[quote]attydeb2005 wrote:
You’re a douche…and you’re long winded…douchey long winded people usually THRIVE in the spot light. [/quote]
this is the exact reason why i’m also wonderful at public speaking