I will post my temperatures next week, beacuse by mistake I took three times x 2pills of armour every day, I thought it was my vit K2. Anyway I know that armour give me hot hands and feets which is my chronic problem.
my labs from 6.3
Testosterone: 4,67 ng/ml [2,8-8]
LH: 2,15 mIU/ml [1,7- 8,3]
FSH: 1,31 mIU/ml [1-14]
TSH: 3,5 (will lower this)
one month ago got prescription for strong antibiotic for sinus inflamation which I mention before, eat it two weeks, most of pain from top of my head and pitiuary area decrease about 85 %. Left around left temple.
I had again ,muscle aches’’ after training sessions, mild wood night/morning and daily, higher libiod, no bitch estradiol mode, I am much more confident
That is evidence that the problem is corelated with my pitiuary or head area where my hormones are released or with too low TSH, I am considering MRI, also doc give me 30 days clomid test - 50mg every day, but he thought that my T is 2,8 ng/m, I will let him know, maybe he change dosage of clomid.
I passed clomid test, my input was. Was taking 1 pill (50mg) clomid ED by 28 days
Test: 4,67 [2,8-8]
FSH: 1,31 [1-14]
LH:2,15 [1,7- 8,3]
My output:
Test: 12,1 [2,8-8]
FSH: 3,16[1-14]
LH:5,71 [1,7- 8,3]
Progesterone: 0,3 [0,14 - 2,06]
Estradiol: 69 [7,63-42,60]
Doc said that I should take 1 pill of clomid (50mg) every 3 days for four months, and my pituitary ? testicles axis should restart. What do you think about it ? Does anyone tried this ?
Ps. When I was taking clomid I did not have headaches, so problem I in pituitary ?
I have no thyroid due to Hashimoto’s. (autoimmune destruction of thyroid) . I’ve been battling this for 25 years.
I do far better on Synthroid (name brand) and Armour (name brand) in combination. Specifically, 75mcg Synthroid and 90MG Armour every morning.
The natural Armour thyroid helps many people eliminate “brain fog” and other problems.
Oh, and my “T” levels plummeted as my thyroid failed. Recent labs put my “T” levels at 25! Yes, that’s correct, it’s incredibly low without some form of T replacement.
2 months ago, I started Testosterone enanthate injections and they are helping immensely. In the past years I’ve used topical T, with mixed results. I had the best topical results with Axiron, which was able to raise my T levels to 450+.
Since you have no thyroid, you cannot expect your body to function normally. You MUST make adjustments for the way a body performs, metabolizes food, provides cellular energy and so on, with the replacement hormones.
I’ve been reading this forum for some time, and finally signed up. There are quite a few knowledgeable people here. I simply wanted to add that I do best with:
- Synthroid + Armour every morning (don’t do well on generics)
- Proper T replacement
- A TSH level well below 1
- T levels over 450-500
- Regular, significant exercise
- Avoiding excess carbs. From the instant my thyroid failed, I had insulin reactions to carbs. A low carb diet works best for me.
Check your body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky. Body temperatures can be guide to thyroid medication dosing.
E2=69 is a BIG problem. This is a predicable result up high dose SERM [Clomid, Nolvadex etc].
Do you feel bad with Clomid? Some really do.
If you have muscle cramps, that can be from magnesium deficiency.
Statin [cholesterol] drugs can lead to muscle pain for some, and/or a persistent cough.
Thank you for answers. cujet: I tried Armour on small doses but it only gave me ,acceleration’’ and diahrea so I back off with idea of taking it. Reffering to T injections, as my clomid test show my boys work correct, but somehow after thyroid surgery they receive weaker signal (LH,FSH) from pitiuary, and that is I dont want to start T injections. Also my TSH is below 1 and I am now on diet where carbs have priority and I feel great on it. I have to go to pitiuary MRI for my opinion.
KSman:E2=69 is a BIG problem. This is a predicable result up high dose SERM [Clomid, Nolvadex etc]. - Yes it was beacuse Clomid.
Do you feel bad with Clomid?-No significant change to prior situation but my balls grow up a bit, my headaches almost dissapeared -it improve my life , so to not going around house nothing special happened but give me a clue that problem have to be in my pituitary gland.
If you have muscle cramps, that can be from magnesium deficiency.-dont have problem with it at all
Statin [cholesterol] drugs can lead to muscle pain for some, and/or a persistent cough.-dont have problem with it at all
So I repeat my question:Doc said that I should take 1 pill of clomid (50mg) every 3 days for four months, and my pituitary - testicles axis should restart. What do you think about it ? Does anyone tried this ?
If you stimulate your testes that hard, when you taper off of SERM, your testes will then see the weaker LH and will see a signal to go slower.
Search for HPTA restart.
[quote]KSman wrote:
If you stimulate your testes that hard, when you taper off of SERM, your testes will then see the weaker LH and will see a signal to go slower.
Search for HPTA restart.[/quote]
I will refer to this post after my MRI. Beacuse I seen few options of HPTA restart circulating over the web, and I have some questions.
But what I want to mention that after Clomid test (50mg/daily), I feel much better. I have night erections, sometimes spontaneus during day, which is big improvment and gives me big motivation that I am on good path. I dont have numbers, but I am 8 weeks after last clomid 50mg pill, so there is no Clomid in my body. I want to announce that those 5-6 weeks after last pill were terrible. It gives me high estrogenic effects, often terrible mood. But after week 6 night erections start to occur.
[quote]KSman wrote:
If you stimulate your testes that hard, when you taper off of SERM, your testes will then see the weaker LH and will see a signal to go slower.
Search for HPTA restart.[/quote]
I will refer to this post after my MRI. Beacuse I seen few options of HPTA restart circulating over the web, and I have some questions.
But what I want to mention that after Clomid test (50mg/daily), I feel much better. I have night erections, sometimes spontaneus during day, which is big improvment and gives me big motivation that I am on good path. I dont have numbers, but I am 8 weeks after last clomid 50mg pill, so there is no Clomid in my body. I want to announce that those 5-6 weeks after last pill were terrible. It gives me high estrogenic effects, often terrible mood. But after week 6 night erections start to occur.
KSman I’m confused. You sugest to not use Nolvadex with Clomid, and Arimidrex with Clomid, while I found on other sites two protocols which are including those ‘‘mixes’’, links below, read first post thread and all will be clear,
second protocol is made by Dr. Crisler from allthingsmale:
Dr. Crisler’s recommendation for HPTA Restart -
''Start at 12.5mgs Clomid per day. After 3 weeks, run these labs (which you ran before you started, BTW):
TT
LH
FSH
SHBG
E2 (sensitive only)
If you feel much better–the goal of therapy–you are all set. Even if your T levels don’t look great; that would mean you happened to catch your new production level at a trough.
If you don’t feel much better, have your LH and FSH levels risen substantially? If not, increase the dose to 25mgs. A couple weeks later, the same labs again. You can go to 37.5mgs, then 50mg per day if necessary. Notice we are employing 1/4 tab increases, for convenience.
If LH/FSH rose substantially, and T did not, and you still don’t feel well, look to testicular failure as your issue.
Of note, some have gotten great results on only 12.5mgs every other day.
If your T rose nicely, but SHBG also shot up, this counteracts the benefit. The estrogen half of the SERM-class drug did that. Try some Danazol, 50mg per day, oral, to try to lower SHBG.
If E shot up, add anastrazole, starting at 0.25mg every other day, and increase as necessary. Remember, it takes several weeks for E and SHBG to restabilize (SHBG may lower with the E).
Using this protocol can help you avoid going on frank TRT. That would be a good thing.‘’
Thanks for answer, If someone could write valuable information would be nice. Thank you in advance.
Nolvadex does what clomid does and avoids the nasty side effects that some get.
That is true, most docs are in a rut with clomid. Yes it can work well for most.
As I write often:
- SERMs increase E2, not decrease
- if you stop suddenly, your HPTA drowns in E2 and you go backwards
- high dose SERMs can create very high E2 and anastrozole cannot control that
- high dose SERMs create high LH levels and when you stop SERM, LH receptors may have become desensitized to LH. You want the restart to involve LH levels that you can expect post restart, not exaggerated levels that create higher LH drops
- restart should involve anastrozole keyed to your E2 levels and you should cruise on that anastrozole dose during and past the taper phase [typically 0.5mg/week for normal responders]
Hi
I just fund that I have Rathke’s cleft cyst . It’s really small, but I think it make big mess and is culprit of my problems. If you have any info about it or any helpful info post it. I will see soon next endocrinologist to confirm this diagnosis. I occurs after 3 tesla MRI of pituitary gland.
Time of summary. It’s end of the year so I will share with you what happened from last 6 moths.
1.On september I tried one more time clomid on small dose 12,5 ED and after one month I was feeling bad, and blood results look like:
FSH 3,64 mIU/ml - ranges 1,27 - 19,26
LH 6,80 mIU/ml - ranges 1,24 - 8,62
Estradiol 81 pg/ml ( very high)
DHEA 20,61 ng/ml- ranges 1,80 - 12,50
Testosterone 6,65 ng/ml - ranges 1,75 - 7,81
Morning serum blood Cortisol 28,7-ranges 6 -18 µg/dl
Does clomid usually cause elevated cortisol ?
- Then after 6 weeks I made Cortisol, 17 oh progesterone:
17-hydroksyprogesterone 3,05ng/ml - ranges 0,20 - 2,30
Cortisol 16,86 µg/dl- ranges 6-18
- One month later made 1mg dexamethasone test:
before pill:
17-hydroksyprogesterone 2,34 ng/ml 0,20 -2,30
ACTH 83,60 pg/ml 7,20 - 63,30
Cortisol 15,10 µg/dl 6-18
10 hours after 1mg pill:
17-hydroksyprogesteron 1,81 ng/ml 0,20 -2,30
ACTH 1,38 pg/ml 7,20 -63,30
Cortisol 0,44 µg/dl 6-18
Doctor exclude problems with adrenals, but it looks like clomid boost long term not GnRH to produce more LH,FSH but CRH to make more ACTH. During night I have problems with sleep, have weak muscles, high blood pressure, poor healing of wounds, striatons on nails- like something is eating me from inside. Those strange symptoms start after surgery. Signigicant symptom is that after masturbation/sex before surgery I fall asleep immediately, now after masturbation it gets worse, my heart is palpitating and I cant sleep. I had this problem since surgery and first iodotherapy. Never consider it as a issue connected with my ED but now cortisol is a thing to watch. One of doc said that I could have empty sella problem in future. I will have soon next MRI of pituitary.
Do you know how to check is GnRH is secreted normaly from hypothalamus ?
Do you know other tests to check issues with cortisol ? Is urrinary cortisol is credible ?
How should I check catecholamines, beacuse I heard that if they are elevated it can elevate cortisol?
4.Doc prescribe me 50 mg Clomid two times during week for 4 months. But I dont know if i can last so long. I always have problem with defecation on this drug after 3 weeks, and of course feel bad. He said no to Adex beacuse at the moment it will be to much substances in my organism.
So three weeks ago i took nolvadex 4 mg ED for 3 days and I feel completly diffrent than on Clomid, while Clomid raise my cortisol, and I feel that beacuse i was electrised and also raise my weight from 84 to 90 kg - Nolva calm me down and made me depressed, I lost 5 kg of weight (probably water) during one week beacuse I ate 2/3 less than usuall, cause leg bones start hurt me. I leave that drug after 3 days beacuse I cant stand it. But from that time I have 3-4 times morning erection during week, my voice is deeper, I feel generaly better. I feel that cortisol is issue but a bit more enthralled.
Thats all, If you can please answer my questions, and ask me a questions. All the best in new year, I wish you all perserverance.
That is new info for me.
Some males feel bad on Clomid, others are fine.
4mg Nolvadex ED is quite low. Maybe you needed more.
Maybe you felt dropping E2, dropping LH/FSH etc.
DHEA levels are changing. DHEA-S is a better indicator of DHEA status than DHEA itself.
DHEA and progesterone are made in the adrenals [in males].
Progesterone is what cortisol is made from.
With some people, more progesterone seems to be freely converted to cortisol.
Pregnenolone is the raw material for pregnenolone–>DHEA–>testosterone–>estrogens
Pregnenolone is the raw material for pregnenolone–>progesterone–>cortisol etc
More DHEA will not make more cortisol
But more pregnenolone will make more progesterone
Pregnenolone is made from cholesterol in the mitochondria inside of all of your cells.
That is regulated by thyroid hormone fT3.
That leads us to consideration of your thyroid medications.
Please also check your oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky.
If temperatures are high, that might be an indication that dosing is too high.
Note that in males, the testes are a large contributor of pregnenolone.
Over stimulation of the testes may increase pregnenolone and cortisol levels.
E2=81 is indicating that the testes were over stimulated by LH
LH is high because of Clomid.
50mg clomid is stupid high.
High LH can also desensitize the LH receptors.
I think that many of these observed problems are a result of Clomid dose [100mg/week] that was very high.
Some guys are more likely to have these problems and need to use less.
We have a problem where the lab work may be reflecting the effects of too much clomid and that is really not what we need.
Your high ATCH does suggest a direct link to Clomid.
Was this what you were thinking about?
Is your life stressful?
If you do not feel well in Clomid, that might be a stress factor itself.
- Some males feel bad on Clomid, others are fine.
4mg Nolvadex ED is quite low. Maybe you needed more.
Maybe you felt dropping E2, dropping LH/FSH etc.
-Nolva is just diffrent, but defo I was feeling dropping of E2, my bones hurt, I lost 5kg during week. My Nolva is not from pharmacy but from diffrent source. I eat every day 4mg beacuse I would like to check is this not harmful and beacuse I read that 20mg of Nolva = 150mg of clomid. After 3 days I gave up, beacuse of how sleepy, non emotional, ,dry’', I was. But after three weeks I can tell you that I have more morning woods (but not as strong as before surgery) and my voice is deeper, I myself feel better even after those small doses 3 x 4mg i took.Clomid did not fix that. Clomid made me feel electrical (bad bitch). Cortisol and E2 was high so I was pretty nervous and emotional. But coming back to Nolva effect on me. Its only 3 weeks after i took last 4mg. Nolva have 5-7 days half life (the same as clomid). So theoritically I sholud wait nex 3 weeks to summarize.
PS. This might be interesting - After two monthly sessions of Clomid, and those 3 days of Nolva my headaches almost gone (and those ones cover my whole face and skull), I forgott to wrote about it. After first session with clomid headaches were smaller. After second -almost dissapear. Stay only small point of indistinct pain on left side of Sphenoidal sinus, it may be culprit of my problem, but I will have more info after MRI
2.DHEA levels are changing. DHEA-S is a better indicator of DHEA status than DHEA itself.
- I know, but I just choose bad type of horome to check.
3.Pregnenolone is made from cholesterol in the mitochondria inside of all of your cells.
That is regulated by thyroid hormone fT3.
That leads us to consideration of your thyroid medications.
Please also check your oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky.
If temperatures are high, that might be an indication that dosing is too high.
Note that in males, the testes are a large contributor of pregnenolone.
Over stimulation of the testes may increase pregnenolone and cortisol levels.
E2=81 is indicating that the testes were over stimulated by LH
LH is high because of Clomid.
50mg clomid is stupid high.
High LH can also desensitize the LH receptors.
-So reffers to this–> E2=81, it was on one month 12,5mg ED. I did few times my ft3 labs, and it was never high enough like before surgery. But I will do it one more time. Now doc want me to take 100mg 2times on week, which is 14,3 ED.
- Your high ATCH does suggest a direct link to Clomid.
- Could you post any article reffering to this ? I would like to read it, beacuse I cant find anything which reffers to this.
5.Was this what you were thinking about?
https://en.wikipedia.org/...leasing_hormone
-Yes
6.Is your life stressful?
If you do not feel well in Clomid, that might be a stress factor itself.
- I think my life is normal, my problems I treat as a challenge, I approach them with scientific(cold) attitude. Of course I have ups and downs, but who will sort it out if not myself ?
As I wrote - During night I have problems with sleep, have weak muscles, high blood pressure, poor healing of wounds, striatons on nails- like something is eating me from inside. Those strange symptoms start after surgery. Signigicant symptom is that after masturbation/sex before surgery I fall asleep immediately, now after masturbation it gets worse, my heart is palpitating and I cant sleep. I had this problem since surgery and first iodotherapy. Never consider it as a issue connected with my ED but now cortisol is a thing to watch. One of doc said that I could have empty sella problem in future. I will have soon next MRI of pituitary.
So after ejaculation I do not want to sleep. but became more excited. I often wake up during night.
I will check my cateholomines,cortisol beacuse this also may be clue.
- Just my observation…
Magnesium can help with BP.
Do we have lab work for CRP and homocysteine?
You may be dealing with arterial problems - finger nails.
Is there a fold line in your ear lobe? That is another sign.
What helps the arteries?
higher T levels
E2 in lower 20’s
lots of Vit-D3
mid range DHEA or higher
fish oil and other EFA’s
high potency B-complex multi-vits with trace elements, iodine+selenium, most males should not take iron
natural source Vit-E
Vit-C and other anti-oxidants
1.Do we have lab work for CRP and homocysteine?
You may be dealing with arterial problems - finger nails.
Is there a fold line in your ear lobe? That is another sign.
-No I do not have homocysteine, but CRP is always between 1 and 2,1, so in midrange
-This problem occured after thyroid surgery, not before.
-no dont have it
Homocysteine 9,82 umol/l ranges 5,46 — 16,20,
I guess supplementing DHEA is not good idea when someone like me have low FSH,LH beacuse signal to create T is to low?
Hi, I know the reason of my problem, now its confirmed by neurosurgeon. It’s Partially empty sella syndrome (PESE). My pituitary is working partially good beacuse vertically it has 3,5mm, should be 66-6,5 mm. There is nothing to do by surgeon at this moment, beacuse the vhange is to small.
At the moment Im on clomid, my response is good but not as good as before nolva (wrote it earlier), beacuse Nolva makes my PESE a bit worse. Pituitary decrease from 3,8 to 3,5. So 12,5mg clomid ed is not giving me T=1150, but 950 (e2=40). Anyway it’s working, but be carefull with nolva. But due to my pituitary abnormalities on 12,5 ed clomid regime my acth= 130 (10-68) and cortisol=28(8-19), dheaso4 is high as well due to high acth. So this shitty stuff in my case called cortisol is killing my libido, raise my serotonin, and affecting my erection quality and libido.
Beacuse of this I obtain selegiline
I’m on selegiline 5mg/ed from two weeks in this regime: 4 days on, 2 days off (also switched from 12,5 mg clomid ed to 12,5 mg e2d).- It works really good on libido, mood, performance by increasing dopamine. But it raise indirectly also norephirene, beacuse dopamine is precusrsor of it. So my ED issues are still present, beacuse (as I think, but it’s based on facts, if you want I can copy links) Serotonin, Cortisol is high, and norephirene is slightly elevated.
What I want to try ? Mirtazapine, look on pub med, in doses 15mg /day it lower cortisol, by lowering acth. Adverse effect ? Due to low acth it will be equivalently lower dhea. But as i know you can supplement dhea. Which product is the best for it ? I would preffer capasules rather to syringes.
PS. How did I recognize my problem with cortisol ? Huge amounts of l ascorbic acid, lower secretion of dhea and cortisol, I ate 30-40 grams per day. It’s very sedative, but I noticed better erections and libido. But believe me you dont want to take it longer than 1 month. It has very acid taste, and it gives you digestive problems.
little update: So I had lumbar puncture which lower pressure in my head (they take out surplus of my CSF), and my problems with libido and ED improves around 50%.