Poverty in New Orleans

Off Topic
21

[quote]Just_Wrong wrote:
First of all, don’t tell me to shut the fuck up. This thread was started to excuse the voilence because these people are poor. I never said, nor did I insinuate, that no one needs help. [/quote]

Who here excused violence due to being poor?

[quote]
My ability to come up with a solution is irrelevant, because I have no power to do anything, and neither do you, so by your own standard I could tell you to shut the fuck up. Even if we were both able to come up with a logical solution, the government would tell us both to shut the fuck up, because they’ve “got everything under control”. Let’s not even go there, ok?[/quote]

You have no power to do anything? You mean like donate some money? Yeah, you sure don’t have any power…so you simply sit here and add to the negativity of the situation. I am sure your life is just filled with upsides.

[quote]
You act as though the people who own these stores which are being looted don’t deserve to have their property respected. [/quote]

These people are dying. If you were in that situation, how much “respect” would you give a store filled with food?

[quote]
Bitching about rapes? So now women aren’t entitled to have their bodies respected, either? [/quote]

Things have to be spelled out for you. Rapes are bad, mmm’kay. Getting those people who need to be rescued out of NO takes top priority. Let that sink in for a while before you type anymore bullshit.

[quote]
Donate? As a matter of fact, no. I refuse to donate to the Red Cross so that Madam President can take her $258K off the top. It is my choice and I choose not to. I’ve lived through hurricanes. I know how these agencies operate. [/quote]

You are such a great person, aren’t you?

[quote]
I don’t know how my comments on this obscure website “adds to the negativity”. I haven’t shot, raped or stole from anyone. Put the blame where it belongs, on the people who are doing negative things.[/quote]

If you aren’t part of the solution…

22

[quote]vroom wrote:

Loser.[/quote]

What part of “I have lived through hurricanes. I know how these agencies operate.” do you not understand? Please take a moment to read what I’ve written before you call me a loser. The loser is the person who gives to these agencies thinking “my work here is done”. People don’t bother to find out how much of their money actually gets to the victims, but as long as they’ve given, that’s all that matters, regardless of whose pockets get padded along the way.

And I thought simply throwing money at causes to clear your conscience was an American thing…

23

Bush has only flown over NO in his comfy Air Force 1. The Mayor just went on record during a radio interview BLASTING Bush and his lack of real help. It took him one to two days to fucking come off his god damn vacation for Christ’s sake. If you can find the Mayor’s interview I highly suggest listening to it to get a better glimpse of what they’re all going through. I found it on CNN. com

24

I have to agree with just_wrong on this one. I think everyone was aware of the fact that a storm was coming. You tell me these people couldnt have at least made an effort to get out of the city? It is not the presidents job to get people out of hospitals and shit. New Orleans knew that a storm was coming. Shelters are available for people, and whether or not you are poor, sometimes its a good idea to leave the city because it was known that the storm was coming.

In terms of looting, I think they should be shot. WHat are you going to do with a television? Is that a necessity? NO than you deserve to get shot. I have a comprehension of basic needs, but because they are all poor ok, whatever take food take toilet paper, take necessities? but fishing poles? tv’s? electronics? dont waste time, anyone caught stealing non necessities need to wake up to reality.

Alot of people come into the world poor but that doesnt say they are doomed for life below the poverty line. Get a job, cuz thats how everyone else affords things. If I cant afford things I dont buy em, nor would I steal them. I am just thankful to be able to have necessities and I work to afford luxuries. Why cant everyone else?

I never saw a lack of jobs available at mickey d’s. You dont wana work in fast food? Well what does everyone else without an education do? For those shooting at people, I do wish I could be armed with a few automatic weapons and help people get out of New Orleans safely…

25

Just wrong, you are happily justifying doing nothing to yourself, and as such, your name is right, because that is just wrong.

Of course professionals in aid organizations get paid wages. They also mobolize resources and provide aid. Generally, the lower the percentage of overhead, the better an organization is in terms of utilizing a donation effectively.

I’m sorry you don’t like being called a loser, but your attitude stinks.

26

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Who here excused violence due to being poor?[/quote]

The article quoted at the beginning of this thread…

Actually, my life is filled with upsides, because I don’t depend on anyone else to take care of me. Don’t try to insinuate that I’m poor when you don’t even know me. Here you are trying to argue for the poor people of New Orleans while at the same time trying to insult me by insinuating that I’m poor! What’s up with that? The fact of the matter is that through wise investments over the previous year, I do have money to send, but because I appreciate the value, I refuse to send blindly.

My obviouspoint was that I have no power to influence the government, regardless of any bright idea I may have. I guess you missed that in your ferver to attack me.

And yet I haven’t seen any footage of people stealing this much needed food, only luxury items.

Mmm’kay, well, it’s nice to see you realize that rapes are “bad”. After your last comment on the matter, I wasn’t really sure…

And as I’ve said, civilians were lined up with their own private boats to rescue people and they were shot at. I don’t blame them for turning away.

It’s a subjective matter.

Ridiculing and attacking me is part of the solution? I’ve heard more logical discussions from sixth graders. I expected more from you than a bunch of tired old cliches…

27

[quote]vroom wrote:
Just wrong, you are happily justifying doing nothing to yourself, and as such, your name is right, because that is just wrong.

Of course professionals in aid organizations get paid wages. They also mobolize resources and provide aid. Generally, the lower the percentage of overhead, the better an organization is in terms of utilizing a donation effectively.

I’m sorry you don’t like being called a loser, but your attitude stinks.[/quote]

You can call me whatever you want. Sticks and stones…

My opinion and attitude about these agencies comes from actually having to deal with them in my time of need, from real experience. I have no doubt there’ll be a big Red Cross presence in New Orleans, because that’s where the cameras are. When you live rurally, they don’t have anything for you.

I realize agencies have costs, but morally, the president of the Red Cross should be able to operate without an income, because the people they employ in these postitions are generally wealthy to begin with. I don’t care to help them become richer from the suffering of others, and if this means I have a bad attitude, frankly, I don’t care.

28

Hahahahaha.

Yes, I propose that immediately aid organizations leave the bigger cities and populated areas and head for the countryside, where they can clearly best utilize aid resources.

To me it just sounds like you hold a grudge because other people were helped and not you. Everybody and everything in these here parts enrich somebody, your fight is against the wrong things.

My opinion anyway.

29

[quote]vroom wrote:
When you live rurally, they don’t have anything for you.

Hahahahaha.

Yes, I propose that immediately aid organizations leave the bigger cities and populated areas and head for the countryside, where they can clearly best utilize aid resources.

To me it just sounds like you hold a grudge because other people were helped and not you. Everybody and everything in these here parts enrich somebody, your fight is against the wrong things.

My opinion anyway.[/quote]

What’s so funny, vroom?

I didn’t say that they should leave more densely populated areas in favor of those who live rurally. Are you insinuating that people who live rurally aren’t entitled to help?

If I am bitter, my bitterness would stem from the fact that the Red Cross only cares to help people when they get the benefit of free publicity. Everyone should be bitter about that.

30

[quote]lostinthought wrote:
Bush has only flown over NO in his comfy Air Force 1. The Mayor just went on record during a radio interview BLASTING Bush and his lack of real help. It took him one to two days to fucking come off his god damn vacation for Christ’s sake. [/quote]

You mean he was STILL on vacation? That guy takes more vacations than, say, teachers.

31

[quote]MuscleMachine17 wrote:

Yeah, white people have it bad in America :rolleyes:[/quote]

You ever been to the Appalachian range? Not the only place like that in America, I might add…

32

[quote]Donzi wrote:
deanosumo wrote:
Donzi wrote:

I think its naive to think humans are too weak to take care of themselves and too conditioned to change behaviours.

Following your line of ration about the impact of society’s influence on an individual actions, if society doesn’t hold people accountable for their behaviour how can we expect them to hold themselves accountable? [/quote]

Oh, I agree we should hold people accountable, but you harped on about how anybody could overcome any adversity or barrier, which is patently untrue. Everybody is a product of their environment, to a point. I think we always should try to understand the causes of things. However, I believe in taking a strong stand on things like law and order. On another thread, I suggested that rampaging gangs and people caught looting non-essentials shoud be shot. I think if the word got out that the National Guard were doing this or at least prepared to, things would calm down in a hurry.

33

[quote]Just_Wrong wrote:

First of all, don’t tell me to shut the fuck up. This thread was started to excuse the voilence because these people are poor.[/quote]

Wow, I’ve never been accused of trying to excuse violence before. In fact, quite the opposite. I started this thread to bring to light the fact that the bulk of people living in New Orleans were black, since there seemed to be much confusion on this site as to why the majority of the victims and looters were black.

It was also news to me that so many were poor in New Orleans, and I felt that was relevant also (since I’ve seen that question raised as well). For the record, of course I don’t feel that justifies looting or any crime.

I’m with you there, but I still feel that’s no excuse to not help at all. It’s your responsibility, then, to find out what agencies you can donate to that will make the most of your donation. There have been entire threads on this site devoted to that very purpose. Personally, I ended up giving to the Red Cross anyway, since it seems to be pretty universally accepted that the Red Cross and Salvation Army are the two organizations that are best able to help those in need, and seem closest to being “on the front lines,” as it were. Even Bill O’Reilly, who was extremely critical of the Red Cross during 9/11, now recommends giving to them.

Besides, even if 5% of your donation goes to helping somebody, that’s better than 100% of your $0 donation, is it not?

34

[quote]deanosumo wrote:

Oh, I agree we should hold people accountable
[/quote]

So, people do control their own actions and should own them as a product of their own will and desire.

[quote]
but you harped on about how anybody could overcome any adversity or barrier, which is patently untrue.[/quote]

How do you know what people CAN do, are you clairvoyant? Cause, I can only see what they choose to do.

Whats your point? Does that somehow excuse behaviour? If it does then how do we ever get around that defense? Any miserable, lazy, piece of shit could simply relate some sorted tale about his upbringing to justify his need to steal 15 mink coats from the store cause “he never had a chance”.

I know what you are implying but I think it is a bit nieve. Define and limit your use of ‘cause’ and you may have a chance to do that but you will never be able to.

What causes an individuals actions? And can an individual be held responsible if he was raised in a bad environment that influenced his decision making processes? Should he be declared insane since thats how we normally deal with those that break laws without the mental capacity to recognize the wrong doing?

Strong stand, What does that mean? You will cast aside your belief in the influence of environment and upbringing on an individuals behaviour pattern when it relates to law and order. But for other things like dragging your ass out of bed in the morning to get a job then peoples environment is too strong an influence to be dismissed.

Fact is most poverty stricken people in Major US cities have accepted that as a way of life.

I thought you wanted to know the cause of things. Now you are suggesting to shoot people who lived a deprived life and are now for the first time getting the chance to seize some power back from the Man. You can’t have it both ways. Either you hold people accountable for their actions or you don’t. And it sounds like you do hold them accountable, so drop the bullshit ‘product of your environment’ excuse if you are not willing to carry it through.

I grew up in New Orleans, and I can tell you first hand that the current method of treating people like they are incapable of providing for themselves by offering permanent Gov’t or state assistance is the most crippling thing to happen to impoverished N.O. citizens. You are seeing the product of that process right now. You have a herd of people that are uneducated about providing for themselves. Its not about money, the tsunami that hit Thailand devestated an etremely poor and impoverihed area. And we didn’t see widespread rioting and looting. We saw people sticking together and helping each other survive. How do explain the difference in reactions to these events?