Obama and Acorn Plus Voter Fraud

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
101

[quote]The Mage wrote:
It doesn’t matter if ACORN says they were contacted or not, they are still being investigated by the FBI. [/quote]

Do you work for the FBI and know this first hand? I have heard it claimed that the FBI is investigating, but I cannot find a credible reference of any concrete action being taken. ‘Investigate’ is a pretty weak word that could be anything from making a phone call to preparing criminal charges. In the not so distant past, an FBI investigation could even be the result of the director’s personal grudge. Is there any evidence that the FBI is preparing to prosecute?

Any raids by the FBI? Any supenas issued against Acorn?

102

[quote]Journeyman wrote:
The Mage wrote:
It doesn’t matter if ACORN says they were contacted or not, they are still being investigated by the FBI.

Do you work for the FBI and know this first hand?

[/quote]

I was quoting the New York Times.

Try reading my post. Everything I stated was from news sources.

103

[quote]The Mage wrote:
Journeyman wrote:
The Mage wrote:
It doesn’t matter if ACORN says they were contacted or not, they are still being investigated by the FBI.

Do you work for the FBI and know this first hand?

I was quoting the New York Times.

Try reading my post. Everything I stated was from news sources.[/quote]

Your first mistake.

104

[quote]Journeyman wrote:
The Mage wrote:
It doesn’t matter if ACORN says they were contacted or not, they are still being investigated by the FBI.

Do you work for the FBI and know this first hand? I have heard it claimed that the FBI is investigating, but I cannot find a credible reference of any concrete action being taken. ‘Investigate’ is a pretty weak word that could be anything from making a phone call to preparing criminal charges. In the not so distant past, an FBI investigation could even be the result of the director’s personal grudge. Is there any evidence that the FBI is preparing to prosecute?

Any raids by the FBI? Any supenas issued against Acorn?

[/quote]

Yes, in 12 states…Don’t you read?

105

[quote]The Mage wrote:
I was quoting the New York Times.

Try reading my post. Everything I stated was from news sources.[/quote]

Hedo referenced the New York Times in his post at 10-22-2008, 09:02 AM. There is no mention of the FBI. The first mention of the FBI is from dhickey on 10-18-2008, 10:07 AM. This were specific claims that Acorn was hiding computers that the FBI wants. That would suggest that there was a warrant that was being actively resisted. I wanted to understand why someone would make such a claim.

In your post from 10-27-2008, 05:10 AM there is reference given. I only see two posts from you on this forum. So once again, please state your reference with enough detail that we can actually access it. This is a simple request. Play your cards or fold.

I agree that Acorn needs to be investigated. When there is evidence of intentional voter fraud, its members and leaders should be prosecuted. Strongly. The same is true of anyone that tries to trick voters into believing that they cannot vote. I’m old enough to remember the Voting Rights Act: there has been a long history of suppressing the vote in this country. I want to believe that we are past this, but as long as there are elections that matter, there is a motive for election fraud. We need to be vigilant. But that doesn’t mean that we need to exaggerate the danger. We need to keep cooler heads and eliminate the real threats, not the perceived threats.

106

[quote]Journeyman wrote:
The Mage wrote:
I was quoting the New York Times.

Try reading my post. Everything I stated was from news sources.

Hedo referenced the New York Times in his post at 10-22-2008, 09:02 AM. There is no mention of the FBI. The first mention of the FBI is from dhickey on 10-18-2008, 10:07 AM.

This were specific claims that Acorn was hiding computers that the FBI wants. That would suggest that there was a warrant that was being actively resisted. I wanted to understand why someone would make such a claim.

In your post from 10-27-2008, 05:10 AM there is reference given. I only see two posts from you on this forum. So once again, please state your reference with enough detail that we can actually access it. This is a simple request. Play your cards or fold.

I agree that Acorn needs to be investigated. When there is evidence of intentional voter fraud, its members and leaders should be prosecuted. Strongly. The same is true of anyone that tries to trick voters into believing that they cannot vote.

I’m old enough to remember the Voting Rights Act: there has been a long history of suppressing the vote in this country. I want to believe that we are past this, but as long as there are elections that matter, there is a motive for election fraud.

We need to be vigilant. But that doesn’t mean that we need to exaggerate the danger. We need to keep cooler heads and eliminate the real threats, not the perceived threats.[/quote]

Google acorn and fbi they are investigating but they are not talking much about it. That is the way it works.

107

[quote]Journeyman wrote:
The Mage wrote:
I was quoting the New York Times.

Try reading my post. Everything I stated was from news sources.

Hedo referenced the New York Times in his post at 10-22-2008, 09:02 AM. There is no mention of the FBI. The first mention of the FBI is from dhickey on 10-18-2008, 10:07 AM. This were specific claims that Acorn was hiding computers that the FBI wants.

That would suggest that there was a warrant that was being actively resisted. I wanted to understand why someone would make such a claim.

In your post from 10-27-2008, 05:10 AM there is reference given. I only see two posts from you on this forum. So once again, please state your reference with enough detail that we can actually access it. This is a simple request. Play your cards or fold.

I agree that Acorn needs to be investigated. When there is evidence of intentional voter fraud, its members and leaders should be prosecuted. Strongly. The same is true of anyone that tries to trick voters into believing that they cannot vote.

I’m old enough to remember the Voting Rights Act: there has been a long history of suppressing the vote in this country. I want to believe that we are past this, but as long as there are elections that matter, there is a motive for election fraud.

We need to be vigilant. But that doesn’t mean that we need to exaggerate the danger. We need to keep cooler heads and eliminate the real threats, not the perceived threats.[/quote]

Well the issued subpoenas in and raided offices in 12 states, namely Ohio and Nevada…These were kick the door down and take any and all evidence from the scene raids. This is not an exaggeration, this is what happened. What happens next, who knows? It depends on what the evidence says and where it leads.

108

[quote]Journeyman wrote:

Hedo referenced the New York Times in his post at 10-22-2008, 09:02 AM. There is no mention of the FBI. The first mention of the FBI is from dhickey on 10-18-2008, 10:07 AM. This were specific claims that Acorn was hiding computers that the FBI wants. That would suggest that there was a warrant that was being actively resisted. I wanted to understand why someone would make such a claim.[/quote]

I am not Hedo, I am not dhickey, and I am not referencing them, as I said I was referencing a New York Times article I had open at the time.[quote]

In your post from 10-27-2008, 05:10 AM there is reference given. I only see two posts from you on this forum. So once again, please state your reference with enough detail that we can actually access it. This is a simple request. Play your cards or fold.[/quote]

I assume you mean thread and not forum. I have been posting on this forum since it existed. I used to reference everything I posted, until I realized nobody ever read them.

Anyway, since you are incapable of using Google:

FBI investigating ACORN voter registrations in KC
http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics/story/844799.html

Conyers Unhappy FBI Probe Of ACORN Was Leaked
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/10/16/politics/politico/thecrypt/main4527223.shtml

Officials: FBI investigates ACORN for voter fraud
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hSQRQM34d7S1eOAiEdP7GAxlwf_QD93RUCH80

Oh yeah, NY Times:
F.B.I. Offices Examining Activities of Acorn

(p.s. don’t play cards with a magician.)

Yes all voter fraud needs to be investigated, and perpetrators need to be put into jail.

But signing up dead people to vote is obvious voter fraud. But some people try to say that asking for ID is “suppressing the vote”. Which is total bullshit, and a blatant example of trying to twist a prevention of voter fraud into voter fraud. (Gee, why would anyone want to do that? Hmmm.)

109

@pat

Once again, this is interesting if true. Where is the evidence?

@the mage

  1. yYes, I meant thread, not forum. I will admit to making an occasional mistake

  2. I realize that you are neither Hedo not dhinkey. My original post was in response to their comments. I did see several of the links you kindly provided. You have been helpful. We may have different viewpoints, but I think we both care about evidence and are willing to be swayed by facts.

Your reference all indicate that the FBI is investigating Acorn. I accept that as fact, I have not contested that Acorn is being investigated. Given the severity of the allegations, the FBI would be negligent if it didn’t investigate.

What I did contest were claims that the FBI is raiding Acorn and that Acorn must be doing something wrong if they are even getting the attention of the Supreme Court. After all, lots of people get investigated, but that doesn’t make you guilty. After looking at my post, I can see that I could have worded that better. But I have not seen any support for the original assertions that the FBI was raiding Acorn and that Acorn was actively hiding computers from the FBI.

Your referenced articles also discussed how some of the executives of Acorn have been accused of embezzlement. That was news to me. If guilty, they should be put away.

Personally, I wouldn’t mind presenting an ID in order to vote. That seems reasonable. BUT, that has not been the case historically. There is no requirement that a citizen obtain a government ID. I have heard that 6-10% of the population don’t have a government ID. I am a bit skeptical that the level is that high, but we are not required to have a government ID and yet we still have a constitutional right to vote. Unless we amend the Constitution, there may not be any way to require something like a passport or driver’s license.

Here is an example of suppressing the vote. This is subtle, and is not evidence of wrong doing, but it does show that we need to be vigilant. At least historically, it has often been the case the districts with large minority populations used older, less reliable voting machines. These machines would often produce under counts of several percent, sometimes even over 10%. So this had the effect reducing minority votes. There doesn’t need to be anything sinister about this: the voting machines were purchased locally, and the wealthy districts were able to afford better voting machines.

Still, it had an unintended effect of undercutting the ‘one man, one vote’ ideal. At least in home state, Iowa, the state has been careful to make sure that there is no such bias in the actual voting machines.

110

[quote]Journeyman wrote:
@pat

Once again, this is interesting if true. Where is the evidence?

@the mage

  1. yYes, I meant thread, not forum. I will admit to making an occasional mistake

  2. I realize that you are neither Hedo not dhinkey. My original post was in response to their comments. I did see several of the links you kindly provided. You have been helpful. We may have different viewpoints, but I think we both care about evidence and are willing to be swayed by facts.

Your reference all indicate that the FBI is investigating Acorn. I accept that as fact, I have not contested that Acorn is being investigated. Given the severity of the allegations, the FBI would be negligent if it didn’t investigate.

What I did contest were claims that the FBI is raiding Acorn and that Acorn must be doing something wrong if they are even getting the attention of the Supreme Court. After all, lots of people get investigated, but that doesn’t make you guilty. After looking at my post, I can see that I could have worded that better. But I have not seen any support for the original assertions that the FBI was raiding Acorn and that Acorn was actively hiding computers from the FBI.

Your referenced articles also discussed how some of the executives of Acorn have been accused of embezzlement. That was news to me. If guilty, they should be put away.

Personally, I wouldn’t mind presenting an ID in order to vote. That seems reasonable. BUT, that has not been the case historically. There is no requirement that a citizen obtain a government ID. I have heard that 6-10% of the population don’t have a government ID. I am a bit skeptical that the level is that high, but we are not required to have a government ID and yet we still have a constitutional right to vote. Unless we amend the Constitution, there may not be any way to require something like a passport or driver’s license.

Here is an example of suppressing the vote. This is subtle, and is not evidence of wrong doing, but it does show that we need to be vigilant. At least historically, it has often been the case the districts with large minority populations used older, less reliable voting machines. These machines would often produce under counts of several percent, sometimes even over 10%. So this had the effect reducing minority votes. There doesn’t need to be anything sinister about this: the voting machines were purchased locally, and the wealthy districts were able to afford better voting machines.

Still, it had an unintended effect of undercutting the ‘one man, one vote’ ideal. At least in home state, Iowa, the state has been careful to make sure that there is no such bias in the actual voting machines.[/quote]

I have the same resources as you…I can only be as certain as what has been written about the matter. Media outlets have reported these things have been going on…Do I know beyond the shadow of a doubt, no. I am not certain of anything if you want to get metaphysical about it, but I do not see why a left leaning media has to gain by reporting a false story about another left leaning organization. With that being the case, I believe there is truth to the story. How much, I’ll never know.

111

http://wewillnotbesilenced2008.com/video/index.htm

Democrats saying fraud started in the primaries.

112

[quote]dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
pat wrote:
100meters wrote:
hedo wrote:
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM106_obama_doj_letter.html

Complaining about voter fraud is also a crime in the eyes of the messiah. You will be assimilated or perish.

Imagine what happens if he gets control of the DOJ.

Suppressing vote due to fake and invented voter fraud obviously a serious issue for voters, and a deliberate strategy by Republicans. Witness the phony outrage over ACORN.

Because you say it doesn’t make it true.

Again, there is a federal investigation in 12 states over ACORN’s phony registrations. Obama has ties to ACORN, he gave them a lot of money and they, supposedly non-partisan, gave hims support. There is more than one thing wrong here. These are the fact and they are not in dispute, so what do you not get? Is it that hard?

Acorn pays folks to register voters. Sometimes they get screwed by lame workers. They mark the bad registrations, and legally have to turn them in. That you know there are bad ACORN registrations is because ACORN said they were bad. ACORN has been screwed. Not voters. It is voter registration fraud. Not voter fraud. Stop being a phony and move on to another phony issue.

you’re wrong. it is much more than this. that’s why people are going to jail. you need read or watch the news.[/quote]

People go to jail for registration fraud. Not voter fraud. You can’t arrest dead people and disney characters! For goodness sakes can you be this stupid?

113

[quote]100meters wrote:
dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
pat wrote:
100meters wrote:
hedo wrote:
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM106_obama_doj_letter.html

Complaining about voter fraud is also a crime in the eyes of the messiah. You will be assimilated or perish.

Imagine what happens if he gets control of the DOJ.

Suppressing vote due to fake and invented voter fraud obviously a serious issue for voters, and a deliberate strategy by Republicans. Witness the phony outrage over ACORN.

Because you say it doesn’t make it true.

Again, there is a federal investigation in 12 states over ACORN’s phony registrations. Obama has ties to ACORN, he gave them a lot of money and they, supposedly non-partisan, gave hims support. There is more than one thing wrong here. These are the fact and they are not in dispute, so what do you not get? Is it that hard?

Acorn pays folks to register voters. Sometimes they get screwed by lame workers. They mark the bad registrations, and legally have to turn them in. That you know there are bad ACORN registrations is because ACORN said they were bad. ACORN has been screwed. Not voters. It is voter registration fraud. Not voter fraud. Stop being a phony and move on to another phony issue.

you’re wrong. it is much more than this. that’s why people are going to jail. you need read or watch the news.

People go to jail for registration fraud. Not voter fraud. You can’t arrest dead people and disney characters! For goodness sakes can you be this stupid?

[/quote]

what exactly is your point in this thread?

a)there is no voter fraud.

b)Registration fraud will not lead to voter fraud.

c)Nobody is being investigated

d)ok, maybe they’re bein investigated but that means nothing. The FBI investigates people all the time.

e)If there really is voter fraud, why are people going to jail.

f)How could they ever catch anyone voting fraudulently.

114

[quote]dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
pat wrote:
100meters wrote:
hedo wrote:
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM106_obama_doj_letter.html

Complaining about voter fraud is also a crime in the eyes of the messiah. You will be assimilated or perish.

Imagine what happens if he gets control of the DOJ.

Suppressing vote due to fake and invented voter fraud obviously a serious issue for voters, and a deliberate strategy by Republicans. Witness the phony outrage over ACORN.

Because you say it doesn’t make it true.

Again, there is a federal investigation in 12 states over ACORN’s phony registrations. Obama has ties to ACORN, he gave them a lot of money and they, supposedly non-partisan, gave hims support. There is more than one thing wrong here. These are the fact and they are not in dispute, so what do you not get? Is it that hard?

Acorn pays folks to register voters. Sometimes they get screwed by lame workers. They mark the bad registrations, and legally have to turn them in. That you know there are bad ACORN registrations is because ACORN said they were bad. ACORN has been screwed. Not voters. It is voter registration fraud. Not voter fraud. Stop being a phony and move on to another phony issue.

you’re wrong. it is much more than this. that’s why people are going to jail. you need read or watch the news.

People go to jail for registration fraud. Not voter fraud. You can’t arrest dead people and disney characters! For goodness sakes can you be this stupid?

what exactly is your point in this thread?

a)there is no voter fraud.

b)Registration fraud will not lead to voter fraud.

c)Nobody is being investigated

d)ok, maybe they’re bein investigated but that means nothing. The FBI investigates people all the time.

e)If there really is voter fraud, why are people going to jail.

f)How could they ever catch anyone voting fraudulently.[/quote]

The point is you and republicans are using the actual issue of voter registration fraud done by employees of ACORN (a fraud done to ACORN and flagged by ACORN) and conflating it with the phony issue of voter fraud in order to suppress votes.

It’s not really that confusing. You know that “Laramie’s Dry Cleaning” will never vote on Tuesday, but you have to pretend to be outraged in order to try to purge voter rolls.

115

[quote]100meters wrote:
dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
pat wrote:
100meters wrote:
hedo wrote:
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM106_obama_doj_letter.html

Complaining about voter fraud is also a crime in the eyes of the messiah. You will be assimilated or perish.

Imagine what happens if he gets control of the DOJ.

Suppressing vote due to fake and invented voter fraud obviously a serious issue for voters, and a deliberate strategy by Republicans. Witness the phony outrage over ACORN.

Because you say it doesn’t make it true.

Again, there is a federal investigation in 12 states over ACORN’s phony registrations. Obama has ties to ACORN, he gave them a lot of money and they, supposedly non-partisan, gave hims support. There is more than one thing wrong here. These are the fact and they are not in dispute, so what do you not get? Is it that hard?

Acorn pays folks to register voters. Sometimes they get screwed by lame workers. They mark the bad registrations, and legally have to turn them in. That you know there are bad ACORN registrations is because ACORN said they were bad. ACORN has been screwed. Not voters. It is voter registration fraud. Not voter fraud. Stop being a phony and move on to another phony issue.

you’re wrong. it is much more than this. that’s why people are going to jail. you need read or watch the news.

People go to jail for registration fraud. Not voter fraud. You can’t arrest dead people and disney characters! For goodness sakes can you be this stupid?

what exactly is your point in this thread?

a)there is no voter fraud.

b)Registration fraud will not lead to voter fraud.

c)Nobody is being investigated

d)ok, maybe they’re bein investigated but that means nothing. The FBI investigates people all the time.

e)If there really is voter fraud, why are people going to jail.

f)How could they ever catch anyone voting fraudulently.

The point is you and republicans are using the actual issue of voter registration fraud done by employees of ACORN (a fraud done to ACORN and flagged by ACORN) and conflating it with the phony issue of voter fraud in order to suppress votes.

It’s not really that confusing. You know that “Laramie’s Dry Cleaning” will never vote on Tuesday, but you have to pretend to be outraged in order to try to purge voter rolls.
[/quote]

This is not the case at all. Voter registration fraud is fraud for a reason. If you don’t think that hundreds of thousands of fraudulent registrations jams the system and makes voter fraud much easier to propagate, I don’t know how to help you.

ACORN is not the innocent victim of employee fraud. If they were, wouldn’t they be assisting investagators? Hundreds of thousands of fraudulent registrations are coming in. They have no quality control. Whistle blowers within ACORN are starting to come out of the woodwork to say this is intentional. ACORN is being investagated in several states by the states themselves and the FBI.

If you don’t beleive anything dubious is going on here you are blind.

116

[quote]100meters wrote:
dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
dhickey wrote:
100meters wrote:
pat wrote:
100meters wrote:
hedo wrote:
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM106_obama_doj_letter.html

Complaining about voter fraud is also a crime in the eyes of the messiah. You will be assimilated or perish.

Imagine what happens if he gets control of the DOJ.

Suppressing vote due to fake and invented voter fraud obviously a serious issue for voters, and a deliberate strategy by Republicans. Witness the phony outrage over ACORN.

Because you say it doesn’t make it true.

Again, there is a federal investigation in 12 states over ACORN’s phony registrations. Obama has ties to ACORN, he gave them a lot of money and they, supposedly non-partisan, gave hims support. There is more than one thing wrong here. These are the fact and they are not in dispute, so what do you not get? Is it that hard?

Acorn pays folks to register voters. Sometimes they get screwed by lame workers. They mark the bad registrations, and legally have to turn them in. That you know there are bad ACORN registrations is because ACORN said they were bad. ACORN has been screwed. Not voters. It is voter registration fraud. Not voter fraud. Stop being a phony and move on to another phony issue.

you’re wrong. it is much more than this. that’s why people are going to jail. you need read or watch the news.

People go to jail for registration fraud. Not voter fraud. You can’t arrest dead people and disney characters! For goodness sakes can you be this stupid?

what exactly is your point in this thread?

a)there is no voter fraud.

b)Registration fraud will not lead to voter fraud.

c)Nobody is being investigated

d)ok, maybe they’re bein investigated but that means nothing. The FBI investigates people all the time.

e)If there really is voter fraud, why are people going to jail.

f)How could they ever catch anyone voting fraudulently.

The point is you and republicans are using the actual issue of voter registration fraud done by employees of ACORN (a fraud done to ACORN and flagged by ACORN) and conflating it with the phony issue of voter fraud in order to suppress votes.

It’s not really that confusing. You know that “Laramie’s Dry Cleaning” will never vote on Tuesday, but you have to pretend to be outraged in order to try to purge voter rolls.
[/quote]

There are plenty of dead and flat phony people registered and in most states, where they do not check ID, these people can vote.

I find it interesting that where it helps your lord and savior of socialism it’s no big deal…If it were helping McCain you’d be throwing a shit fit.

117

[quote]100meters wrote:

It’s not really that confusing. You know that “Laramie’s Dry Cleaning” will never vote on Tuesday, but you have to pretend to be outraged in order to try to purge voter rolls.

[/quote]

Why do you keep using obvious joke registrations as your examples? What about, say, a fake Jeremy Peterson?

118

[quote]Sloth wrote:
100meters wrote:

It’s not really that confusing. You know that “Laramie’s Dry Cleaning” will never vote on Tuesday, but you have to pretend to be outraged in order to try to purge voter rolls.

Why do you keep using obvious joke registrations as your examples? What about, say, a fake Jeremy Peterson?[/quote]

What’s the difference? A fake “Jeremy Peterson” or Mickey Mouse – he still has to exist and reside at the residence listed, in the town he is voting.

Drinking the ACORN Kool-Aid

YOU WANT ACTUAL VOTE FRAUD - how about courtroom testimony admitting to actual electronic vote rigging through modified software

119

[quote]JustTheFacts wrote:
Sloth wrote:
100meters wrote:

It’s not really that confusing. You know that “Laramie’s Dry Cleaning” will never vote on Tuesday, but you have to pretend to be outraged in order to try to purge voter rolls.

Why do you keep using obvious joke registrations as your examples? What about, say, a fake Jeremy Peterson?

What’s the difference? A fake “Jeremy Peterson” or Mickey Mouse – he still has to exist and reside at the residence listed, in the town he is voting.

Drinking the ACORN Kool-Aid

YOU WANT ACTUAL VOTE FRAUD - how about courtroom testimony admitting to actual electronic vote rigging through modified software

[/quote]

I am trying to figure out what this article means. It really seems to say nothing at all.

What does this really mean? I understand leftists want people to able to vote without id that you need to buy cigarettes or beer, but what are the algorithims they are talking about?

Again, no details.

Don’t understand this either. I get mail when I’m not home.

This seems a little fishy if not overexagerated. How would this be targeting specific voters? Again, not much detail.

Again, no detail.

Why wouldn’t the name have to match the registration?

good advise.

Again, if you are who you say you are, you are able to vote. If you are not smart enough to fill out a registration form, should you really be voting?

120

[quote]JustTheFacts wrote:

What’s the difference? A fake “Jeremy Peterson” or Mickey Mouse – he still has to exist and reside at the residence listed, in the town he is voting.

[/quote]

But we are not supposed to be checking that information out, because it is called voter suppression. And asking for voter I.D. is also voter suppression.

The system is being flooded with fake registrations, under the hope that it will overwhelm the system, and the people cannot verify every single one.

Does anyone think every fake registration is going to get caught?

Who is verifying the absentee votes? Oh wait, that’s voter suppression.