Misconceptions of Christianity 2

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
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[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …movies, books and music are all conduits for creativity, wisdom and truths. A movie like “Dead Man” is steeped in symbolism and allegory and tells a story that’s as old as mankind in a captivating, original and beautiful way. But to each his own…[/quote]
Not surprisingly I would say movies and music are almost universally conduits for just about anything other than wisdom or truth though creativity I’ll concede. Oh, I got the symbolism and allegory and it certainly does tell a story as old as mankind. Guess which one I’m gonna say =]

I found this particular expression of the same story clumsy and contrived. We spend 2 hours being treated to the ultimate amorality of everything (in a nutshell) which then culminates in good and evil, neither of which is fully one or the other, killing each other off as the subject floats off into a sea that goes apparently nowhere (dies). Moral of the story? Nothing really means anything which somehow is clearly expected to be received with great meaning. Different vehicle, same story with a certain level of the above conceded creativity.[/quote]

…if you believe there’s only one source of truth and wisdom, ofcourse you’d never consider a mere movie to be something other than amusement. And it’s as obvious to me that, if your perception on life is black and white/good vs evil and nothing more, any and all ambiguity towards that perception is met with scepticism; ridicule even…

202

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]MikeTheBear wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]MikeTheBear wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

…well okay. I will take the position that religous beliefs fuel, and are firmly based on/in, emotion. Take emotion out of the religious equation and you’re left with very little. I’m not saying that’s the case with you, but look at pentacostals and evangelists; they can only thrive because it relies on emotion for impact. Emotion is a vital component of the religious experience…
[/quote]

I understand what you are getting at, if you are talking about those Christian denominations that are of those names. Yes, that makes sense where you would get that idea. However, that is not my religion and I am not sure how you would go ahead an make an apologetic argument for it since I do not believe that is the correct way to do things.

However, when I say we have ways of discerning, I mean we actually have set practices for discernment. Check out: http://www.ccr.org.au/discern.html - based on S. Ignatius’ Discernment.[/quote]

…this jumped out: “When someone comes to experience the reality of the spiritual world and discovers that God is a personal being who is vitally interested in every aspect of their life, (…)” The rest reads like a manual for selfhypnosis setting-up conditions that’ll lead to preset experiences, very nifty…

…however, a personal being? Oddly enough, i’ve never seen god refered to being personal like this before, altough it should’ve been obvious to me that god would be perceived as such. It makes it even harder to fathom how one can believe the creator of everything and anything is a personal being. Anyway that’s neither here nor there…

…question: does everything i say, or any link that i post, just reinforce what you already believe? Because, somehow, nothing that’s said by the believers in the various threads made me reconsider my position, eventhough i learned a lot from you [plural]…
[/quote]

The discernment stuff was interesting - I had never read that before. However, I agree with ephrem. It’s really just a variation of self-hypnosis or meditation techniques. And at the risk of offending you, Chris, while I was reading that stuff the whole Star Wars saga came to mind - use the Force, Luke, don’t give in to hate. Interesting, nonetheless.[/quote]

Interesting enough, Star Wars has direct roots in a great heresy. Manicheanism. [/quote]

I did not know it was related to a specific religion. I had read that it had Christian undertones given that Annakin Skywalker’s conception was somewhat of a mystery - not necessarily a virgin birth but apparently his conception was asexual.

This is why I find these threads interesting. It would be interesting to hear everyone’s views on the Dan Brown books.[/quote]

Hopefully we can all agree that Dan Brown books are really bad (succesful so hats off to him there) but really badly written.[/quote]

From the excerpts I’ve seen, his writing is embarrassingly bad; moreover, what he’s trying to say is so absolutely trite, it’s painful to read. It says a lot about our culture that he’ so successful.

[/quote]

I read The Divinci Code because a friend recommended it, I was amazed at how bad it was given how succesful it was. The ‘what did you think’ conversation with the friend was tough.[/quote]

In the passed few months I have been recommended that book and movie by so many people, I would never read the book, and the movie was mere conspiracy.

203

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …movies, books and music are all conduits for creativity, wisdom and truths. A movie like “Dead Man” is steeped in symbolism and allegory and tells a story that’s as old as mankind in a captivating, original and beautiful way. But to each his own…[/quote]
Not surprisingly I would say movies and music are almost universally conduits for just about anything other than wisdom or truth though creativity I’ll concede. Oh, I got the symbolism and allegory and it certainly does tell a story as old as mankind. Guess which one I’m gonna say =]

I found this particular expression of the same story clumsy and contrived. We spend 2 hours being treated to the ultimate amorality of everything (in a nutshell) which then culminates in good and evil, neither of which is fully one or the other, killing each other off as the subject floats off into a sea that goes apparently nowhere (dies). Moral of the story? Nothing really means anything which somehow is clearly expected to be received with great meaning. Different vehicle, same story with a certain level of the above conceded creativity.

[/quote]

Huh?! No way! I have found very profound movies, music and art of all kinds. Yeah, some people use it to express contrary views as well, but that’s the beauty of it. I have been touched by many forms of art before.

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[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …movies, books and music are all conduits for creativity, wisdom and truths. A movie like “Dead Man” is steeped in symbolism and allegory and tells a story that’s as old as mankind in a captivating, original and beautiful way. But to each his own…[/quote]
Not surprisingly I would say movies and music are almost universally conduits for just about anything other than wisdom or truth though creativity I’ll concede. Oh, I got the symbolism and allegory and it certainly does tell a story as old as mankind. Guess which one I’m gonna say =]

I found this particular expression of the same story clumsy and contrived. We spend 2 hours being treated to the ultimate amorality of everything (in a nutshell) which then culminates in good and evil, neither of which is fully one or the other, killing each other off as the subject floats off into a sea that goes apparently nowhere (dies). Moral of the story? Nothing really means anything which somehow is clearly expected to be received with great meaning. Different vehicle, same story with a certain level of the above conceded creativity.[/quote]

…if you believe there’s only one source of truth and wisdom, ofcourse you’d never consider a mere movie to be something other than amusement. And it’s as obvious to me that, if your perception on life is black and white/good vs evil and nothing more, any and all ambiguity towards that perception is met with scepticism; ridicule even…[/quote]

Mere movies can be quite powerful…

205

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …movies, books and music are all conduits for creativity, wisdom and truths. A movie like “Dead Man” is steeped in symbolism and allegory and tells a story that’s as old as mankind in a captivating, original and beautiful way. But to each his own…[/quote]
Not surprisingly I would say movies and music are almost universally conduits for just about anything other than wisdom or truth though creativity I’ll concede. Oh, I got the symbolism and allegory and it certainly does tell a story as old as mankind. Guess which one I’m gonna say =]

I found this particular expression of the same story clumsy and contrived. We spend 2 hours being treated to the ultimate amorality of everything (in a nutshell) which then culminates in good and evil, neither of which is fully one or the other, killing each other off as the subject floats off into a sea that goes apparently nowhere (dies). Moral of the story? Nothing really means anything which somehow is clearly expected to be received with great meaning. Different vehicle, same story with a certain level of the above conceded creativity.[/quote]

…if you believe there’s only one source of truth and wisdom, of course you’d never consider a mere movie to be something other than amusement. And it’s as obvious to me that, if your perception on life is black and white/good vs evil and nothing more, any and all ambiguity towards that perception is met with skepticism; ridicule even…[/quote]
Well said, but ridicule must be utilized with care and wisdom. However, once again, every last particle of reality, including movies and music DO testify to the truth and glory of the one true God. In the case of music and movies they loudly and clearly testify to the utter hopelessness and futility of man’s use of his God given talents in the service of himself thus heightening his judgment if he persists in his sinful independence until death.

So on one hand the last place I’d ever look for anything intentionally substantive about anything substantive are entertainers, on the other, even the futile prattling stabs at profundity from Jim Jarmusch or Neil Peart (my favorite band of all time) serves to unmistakably testify to fallen man’s death in trespasses and sins. For me the absolute pinnacle of moving picture gravitas is Looney Tunes. Can’t get any better than that and I’m dead serious.

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[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …movies, books and music are all conduits for creativity, wisdom and truths. A movie like “Dead Man” is steeped in symbolism and allegory and tells a story that’s as old as mankind in a captivating, original and beautiful way. But to each his own…[/quote]
Not surprisingly I would say movies and music are almost universally conduits for just about anything other than wisdom or truth though creativity I’ll concede. Oh, I got the symbolism and allegory and it certainly does tell a story as old as mankind. Guess which one I’m gonna say =]

I found this particular expression of the same story clumsy and contrived. We spend 2 hours being treated to the ultimate amorality of everything (in a nutshell) which then culminates in good and evil, neither of which is fully one or the other, killing each other off as the subject floats off into a sea that goes apparently nowhere (dies). Moral of the story? Nothing really means anything which somehow is clearly expected to be received with great meaning. Different vehicle, same story with a certain level of the above conceded creativity.[/quote]

…if you believe there’s only one source of truth and wisdom, ofcourse you’d never consider a mere movie to be something other than amusement. And it’s as obvious to me that, if your perception on life is black and white/good vs evil and nothing more, any and all ambiguity towards that perception is met with scepticism; ridicule even…[/quote]

Mere movies can be quite powerful…
[/quote]

…indeed they can be, absolutely…

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[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …movies, books and music are all conduits for creativity, wisdom and truths. A movie like “Dead Man” is steeped in symbolism and allegory and tells a story that’s as old as mankind in a captivating, original and beautiful way. But to each his own…[/quote]
Not surprisingly I would say movies and music are almost universally conduits for just about anything other than wisdom or truth though creativity I’ll concede. Oh, I got the symbolism and allegory and it certainly does tell a story as old as mankind. Guess which one I’m gonna say =]

I found this particular expression of the same story clumsy and contrived. We spend 2 hours being treated to the ultimate amorality of everything (in a nutshell) which then culminates in good and evil, neither of which is fully one or the other, killing each other off as the subject floats off into a sea that goes apparently nowhere (dies). Moral of the story? Nothing really means anything which somehow is clearly expected to be received with great meaning. Different vehicle, same story with a certain level of the above conceded creativity.[/quote]

…if you believe there’s only one source of truth and wisdom, of course you’d never consider a mere movie to be something other than amusement. And it’s as obvious to me that, if your perception on life is black and white/good vs evil and nothing more, any and all ambiguity towards that perception is met with skepticism; ridicule even…[/quote]
Well said, but ridicule must be utilized with care and wisdom. However, once again, every last particle of reality, including movies and music DO testify to the truth and glory of the one true God. In the case of music and movies they loudly and clearly testify to the utter hopelessness and futility of man’s use of his God given talents in the service of himself thus heightening his judgment if he persists in his sinful independence until death.

So on one hand the last place I’d ever look for anything intentionally substantive about anything substantive are entertainers, on the other, even the futile prattling stabs at profundity from Jim Jarmusch or Neil Peart (my favorite band of all time) serves to unmistakably testify to fallen man’s death in trespasses and sins. For me the absolute pinnacle of moving picture gravitas is Looney Tunes. Can’t get any better than that and I’m dead serious.[/quote]

…honestly T, almost every post you’re writing lately makes me glad i’m not in your shoes…

208

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …honestly T, almost every post you’re writing lately makes me glad i’m not in your shoes… >>>[/quote]
As compared to the ones from before when you did wish you were in my shoes? Quite blessedly for me they’re my shoes and I wouldn’t trade them for anybody’s. That’s actually a pretty funny cartoon dude. You will no doubt by now not be shocked though when I report that having been reborn into the true reality zone and having been around there a while I haven’t seen a shade of gray concerning anything that really matters yet.

Here’s a major point concerning our dialog in the last few weeks that you have not grasped. Actually I believe many Christians also don’t grasp this point. That is that I cannot convert you. By that I mean that my ingenious persuasive accommodation is powerless over life and death (1 Cor. 1:18 ff). Only the Holy Spirit can raise the dead. I can only tell you the truth according to the Word of God which never returns void, but always accomplishes it’s purpose (Isaiah 55:11) whether it be judgment or mercy.

In other words you (or anybody else) wanting to be in my shoes or not has absolutely nothing to do with my success or failure. Obedience is the measure of success. It’s not for me to know whether some seed I’ve planted will bear fruit next week, next year, 2 minutes before you die or not at all. It would be a tremendous joy to hear Jesus say “well done though good and faithful servant” and find out that you were there as well and I was being rewarded for not compromising the Gospel in the name of being popular and inoffensive and that something I said played some part in your salvation. If not there are no tears in the resurrection and I will still be rewarded for my obedience. I would very much prefer the former, but I have no way of knowing. Not at the moment anyway.

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Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting.

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[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?

211

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]
In 1 Corinthians 2:6-8 Paul gives us this:

[quote] 6-Yet we do speak wisdom among those who are mature; a wisdom, however, not of this age nor of the rulers of this age, who are passing away; 7-but we speak God’s wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory; 8-the wisdom which none of the rulers of this age has understood; for if they had understood it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory;[/quote]and then a few verses later 12-13: [quote]12-Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God, 13-which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.[/quote]And then in verse 18 he tells us “WE HAVE THE MIND OF CHRIST!!!” Seriously LOL!!! How is somebody walking the earth with the mind of Him who created all things by the word of His mouth supposed to OOOOH and AHHHH over the pathetic AND sinful musings of some pagan film maker or pharmaceutically impaired musician? Ya gotta be kiddin me.

Like I say, my favorite band still, even from my BC days is RUSH. (I have it tattooed across the knuckles of my left hand) Superb musicians and Peart is an exceptionally ingenious and deep thinking lyricist. Even people who hate the band recognize their first rate quality in these areas. However, the man is an unbeliever. An enemy of my God and as such a dangerously unreliable source of anything other than aesthetic stimulation which can be godly if properly understood even if provided by pagans. I see his groping for the “reality zone” in songs like Mystic Rhythms where he’s tripping over the very God he’s spent his life denying. A song that practically IS the passage from the 1st of Romans I keep repeating.

Christians aren’t searching for anything. We’ve found it. The debate is over. In fact from the perspective of the God we worship and whose mind we have there never was one. That kind of certainly is priceless and IS the very definition of comfort. This will be where you and your friends reason that it’s just this kind of thing that explains the motivation behind otherwise intelligent clear thinking people deluding themselves into believing fairy tales. I will of course reply once again that that’s exactly what I would expect you to say.

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[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]

Because “grey” demands nothing of you & tells you (usually in cloying language…now let’s cue Sesame Street music) that you’re okay just as you are; it flatters you endlessly that you’re not controlled by rigid conventions or rules; and yet, because you have no timeless truth by which to assess and judge (re: actually think) you drift along with the zeigeist of the times, dutifully responding to what you’re told to believe, all the while imagining that you’re a “free spirit,” which is exactly what you aren’t.

To step into a world of black & white is to confront reality as it is. Actually, to complete the metaphor, it is to confront the color grey as it is. What do you think grey is composed of but black & white?

Only the truth is ultimately comforting.

213

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]

Because “grey” demands nothing of you & tells you (usually in cloying language…now let’s cue Sesame Street music) that you’re okay just as you are; it flatters you endlessly that you’re not controlled by rigid conventions or rules; and yet, because you have no timeless truth by which to assess and judge (re: actually think) you drift along with the zeigeist of the times, dutifully responding to what you’re told to believe, all the while imagining that you’re a “free spirit,” which is exactly what you aren’t.

To step into a world of black & white is to confront reality as it is. Actually, to complete the metaphor, it is to confront the color grey as it is. What do you think grey is composed of but black & white?

Only the truth is ultimately comforting. >>>[/quote]
Quite so on all counts. It’s the very essence of the deception of sin that those clanging through life covered in chains will incessantly scorn and deride those who have been set free. Even while the emancipatees (I don’t think that’s a word) lovingly tell them how they too can shed those chains. The realm of the spiritual is the only one where a drowning man will refuse a life preserver and beg for an anchor.

214

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]

Because “grey” demands nothing of you & tells you (usually in cloying language…now let’s cue Sesame Street music) that you’re okay just as you are; it flatters you endlessly that you’re not controlled by rigid conventions or rules; and yet, because you have no timeless truth by which to assess and judge (re: actually think) you drift along with the zeigeist of the times, dutifully responding to what you’re told to believe, all the while imagining that you’re a “free spirit,” which is exactly what you aren’t.

To step into a world of black & white is to confront reality as it is. Actually, to complete the metaphor, it is to confront the color grey as it is. What do you think grey is composed of but black & white?

Only the truth is ultimately comforting. [/quote]

…what you described here is how you perceive moral relativism, not my perception of it. Please keep that in mind…

215

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]
In 1 Corinthians 2:6-8 Paul gives us this:

[quote] 6-Yet we do speak wisdom among those who are mature; a wisdom, however, not of this age nor of the rulers of this age, who are passing away; 7-but we speak God’s wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory; 8-the wisdom which none of the rulers of this age has understood; for if they had understood it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory;[/quote]and then a few verses later 12-13: [quote]12-Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God, 13-which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.[/quote]And then in verse 18 he tells us “WE HAVE THE MIND OF CHRIST!!!” Seriously LOL!!! How is somebody walking the earth with the mind of Him who created all things by the word of His mouth supposed to OOOOH and AHHHH over the pathetic AND sinful musings of some pagan film maker or pharmaceutically impaired musician? Ya gotta be kiddin me.

Like I say, my favorite band still, even from my BC days is RUSH. (I have it tattooed across the knuckles of my left hand) Superb musicians and Peart is an exceptionally ingenious and deep thinking lyricist. Even people who hate the band recognize their first rate quality in these areas. However, the man is an unbeliever. An enemy of my God and as such a dangerously unreliable source of anything other than aesthetic stimulation which can be godly if properly understood even if provided by pagans. I see his groping for the “reality zone” in songs like Mystic Rhythms where he’s tripping over the very God he’s spent his life denying. A song that practically IS the passage from the 1st of Romans I keep repeating.

Christians aren’t searching for anything. We’ve found it. The debate is over. In fact from the perspective of the God we worship and whose mind we have there never was one. That kind of certainly is priceless and IS the very definition of comfort. This will be where you and your friends reason that it’s just this kind of thing that explains the motivation behind otherwise intelligent clear thinking people deluding themselves into believing fairy tales. I will of course reply once again that that’s exactly what I would expect you to say. [/quote]

…let me beat you to the punch and say that this is exactly what i thought you’d say…

216

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]

Because “grey” demands nothing of you & tells you (usually in cloying language…now let’s cue Sesame Street music) that you’re okay just as you are; it flatters you endlessly that you’re not controlled by rigid conventions or rules; and yet, because you have no timeless truth by which to assess and judge (re: actually think) you drift along with the zeigeist of the times, dutifully responding to what you’re told to believe, all the while imagining that you’re a “free spirit,” which is exactly what you aren’t.

To step into a world of black & white is to confront reality as it is. Actually, to complete the metaphor, it is to confront the color grey as it is. What do you think grey is composed of but black & white?

Only the truth is ultimately comforting. >>>[/quote]
Quite so on all counts. It’s the very essence of the deception of sin that those clanging through life covered in chains will incessantly scorn and deride those who have been set free. Even while the emancipatees (I don’t think that’s a word) lovingly tell them how they too can shed those chains. The realm of the spiritual is the only one where a drowning man will refuse a life preserver and beg for an anchor. [/quote]

…if that life preserver is you, or similarly minded people like you, i’d ask for an anchor too you know…

217

[quote]ephrem wrote:
<<< …if that life preserver is you, or similarly minded people like you, i’d ask for an anchor too you know…
[/quote]That’s not very neighborly after all we’ve been though together.

And of course you know what I’m going to say by now. I said that you will know myself a dozen times. I would like to hear your take on moral relativism though, regardless of how cozy we’ve gotten with all this mutual prognostication going back and forth.

You will probably disagree with this (well maybe not), but you would be a blast to know in real life. That is no condescending insult btw.

218

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]

Because “grey” demands nothing of you & tells you (usually in cloying language…now let’s cue Sesame Street music) that you’re okay just as you are; it flatters you endlessly that you’re not controlled by rigid conventions or rules; and yet, because you have no timeless truth by which to assess and judge (re: actually think) you drift along with the zeigeist of the times, dutifully responding to what you’re told to believe, all the while imagining that you’re a “free spirit,” which is exactly what you aren’t.

To step into a world of black & white is to confront reality as it is. Actually, to complete the metaphor, it is to confront the color grey as it is. What do you think grey is composed of but black & white?

Only the truth is ultimately comforting. [/quote]

…what you described here is how you perceive moral relativism, not my perception of it. Please keep that in mind…[/quote]

I see the sickness is deep - Ephrem, do you even believe that we’re able to identify what moral relativism is? Or is that relative to each person too?

219

…i have to go to work now, but i’ll respond later today…

220

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

Ephrem, my good man - that cartoon has it all wrong. It’s the “grey area” that’s (superficially) comforting. [/quote]

…how exactly?
[/quote]

Because “grey” demands nothing of you & tells you (usually in cloying language…now let’s cue Sesame Street music) that you’re okay just as you are; it flatters you endlessly that you’re not controlled by rigid conventions or rules; and yet, because you have no timeless truth by which to assess and judge (re: actually think) you drift along with the zeigeist of the times, dutifully responding to what you’re told to believe, all the while imagining that you’re a “free spirit,” which is exactly what you aren’t.

To step into a world of black & white is to confront reality as it is. Actually, to complete the metaphor, it is to confront the color grey as it is. What do you think grey is composed of but black & white?

Only the truth is ultimately comforting. >>>[/quote]
Quite so on all counts. It’s the very essence of the deception of sin that those clanging through life covered in chains will incessantly scorn and deride those who have been set free. Even while the emancipatees (I don’t think that’s a word) lovingly tell them how they too can shed those chains. The realm of the spiritual is the only one where a drowning man will refuse a life preserver and beg for an anchor. [/quote]

…if that life preserver is you, or similarly minded people like you, i’d ask for an anchor too you know…
[/quote]

I have to say, that’s probably one of the most awful statements I’ve read here in a while. If you only knew…