Man Says He'll Kill Son's Murderer

Off Topic
121

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]dk44 wrote:
I don’t get the hypocritical part either.

Killing the innocent isn’t the same as Killing the guilty.

You are only looking at the end sum and leaving out the rest of the story.

[/quote]

Distinctions. They are always relevant.

When someone with an intellect on par with a head of cabbage struts into a thread like this one with the supremely stupid idea that the value of the innocent five-year old’s life is equivalent to that of the guilty gruesome murderer’s than you know the choo-choo train of logic has done fallen off the trestle.[/quote]

Good one! I love your ability to have a rational point/counterpoint discussion on this.

All your great arguments (and don’t forget personal attacks, well done) have really helped me to come under the impression that you are totally right!

Let’s go get this bastard together Push. Maybe after that you can supply me with infinite knowledge about, well, everything.

122

[quote]SSC wrote:

You guys were never kids that made a stupid mistake? Now, lol, before someone jumps on this point with RABBLERABBLERABBLE obviously killing another person is far different than most dilemmas that kids experience, but that’s just my point. I know if I did something stupid as a kid that I wasn’t supposed I’d be TERRIFIED of fessing up to it and would do everything within my power to hide it. What makes you think a loner kid who murdered another kid wouldn’t do the same? It’s definitely something I can understand, although not necessarily think is correct.[/quote]

This part would make a lot more sense, and maybe even be a sensible addition to the argument, if the kid didn’t try to strangle the paperboy to death 9 years later.

GIANT HUGE RIDICULOUS DISCLAIMER HERE: NOT SAYING MURDERING A 5 YEAR OLD IS OK JUST ROLLING WITH A QUICK THOUGHT PROCESS: Let’s say the kid really did just fuck up big time, maybe he’s mentally incapable and didn’t know stabbing the kid in the chest would kill him and then did indeed try his best to cover his tracks, and then gets tried as an adult, gets big time therapy, etc etc. The story is then completely different. Obviously a parent would still be out of their mind over the death of their child, but I think that scenario could MAYBE fall into Oleena’s ‘worse shit happens’ kind of thing(there are ‘accidental’ kid deaths and tragedies that unfortunately do happen because some parents don’t pay enough attention).

The second that kid, then in his mid 20s, starts to strangle the fucking paperboy though? He is now no longer some sad story that made 1 wrong choice as an immature child(arguable since he was 16 at the time of the first murder anyways, well past the age where you can be tried as an adult); he’s on the path to being a serial killer. There is almost certainly no saving the mind of someone at that point, obviously the kid wasn’t living in shame and guilt and contemplating repentance and a healthy revolution of his life, and you can’t expect life in a 9x9 to magically begin to put that shame and guilt in him, he had the bones of his first murder victim ON HIS FUCKING DRESSER, clearly wasn’t that beat up about it.

123

[quote]red04 wrote:
This part would make a lot more sense, and maybe even be a sensible addition to the argument, if the kid didn’t try to strangle the paperboy to death 9 years later. [/quote]

I see that now. I’m not sure how I missed this nugget, I just went back through and saw that, thanks for pointing it out. Again, as a disclaimer, I’m not trying to insinuate that the kid is/isn’t remorseful and/or actually mentally unstable. I don’t know, because this isn’t information I can possibly know with how much information they gave in the article. That being said,

[quote]GIANT HUGE RIDICULOUS DISCLAIMER HERE: NOT SAYING MURDERING A 5 YEAR OLD IS OK JUST ROLLING WITH A QUICK THOUGHT PROCESS: Let’s say the kid really did just fuck up big time, maybe he’s mentally incapable and didn’t know stabbing the kid in the chest would kill him and then did indeed try his best to cover his tracks, and then gets tried as an adult, gets big time therapy, etc etc. The story is then completely different. Obviously a parent would still be out of their mind over the death of their child, but I think that scenario could MAYBE fall into Oleena’s ‘worse shit happens’ kind of thing(there are ‘accidental’ kid deaths and tragedies that unfortunately do happen because some parents don’t pay enough attention).

The second that kid, then in his mid 20s, starts to strangle the fucking paperboy though? He is now no longer some sad story that made 1 wrong choice as an immature child(arguable since he was 16 at the time of the first murder anyways, well past the age where you can be tried as an adult); he’s on the path to being a serial killer. There is almost certainly no saving the mind of someone at that point, obviously the kid wasn’t living in shame and guilt and contemplating repentance and a healthy revolution of his life, and you can’t expect life in a 9x9 to magically begin to put that shame and guilt in him, he had the bones of his first murder victim ON HIS FUCKING DRESSER, clearly wasn’t that beat up about it.[/quote]

I definitely agree with all of this, well said. The thing that I’m having a tough time conceptualizing is how the distinction is made between when a person’s mental health is surveyed before being released. I know if I hear about the two acts the kid/guy (20s and all) committed I’d think that clearly he was unstable and not capable of rational decision making…

But then you hear that he kept some remains of his victim on his dresser. Is this simply a case of someone being cold and unthinkably remorseless, or someone who has a difficult time separating himself from his personal justifications of the crime and moral code.

He wasn’t charged as being criminally insane, but it leaves one to wonder some of the factors that go into making a decision such as this. He’s being let off for good behavior. Was that calculating compliance, ignorance and stupidity, or genuine change? I don’t know, we don’t know. As people who buy into government and society, we must accept the fact that (supposedly) big brother is there for our best interests. While this is wildly untrue, we kind of have to accept it in stride. If those decision-makers had deemed this to be a case that warranted a life-sentence or death penalty, we wouldn’t be hearing about this right now. But that’s how it is.

Now, let me pose this; A random person who reads this forum gets inspired to carry out retribution as many of the posters early in this thread claimed wish to happen. He goes, kidnaps this guy, and takes him to his shack. He tortures him and kills him. …like posters earlier in this thread said… How is that retribution? To me, that still seems like hateful brutality in its purest form.

Really, you can go back and read my original posts. The only thing I’ve really be questioning (and have yet to hear a response) is how people on here can say that and not be a total hypocrite?

For the record, I am completely open to debate. I find it disappointing that someone who I had respect for would rather throw out empty, personal insults rather than engage in serious dialogue. This isn’t that serious, we are all just critics sitting behind a computer after all.

126

[quote]Oleena wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
One of the definitions of “serial killer” is one who kills at least 3 people in no-consecutive order. Dahmer waited 9 years between his first and second victims. This guy, if not put away, would have slowly escelated his monsterish behavior and more children would’ve gone missing.

What’s wrong with this guy can’t be fixed by time, or abuse, or rape, or whatever. He needs to be put down like a rabid dog, 'cause for all intents and purposes that’s what he is. And, I agree that the father shouldn’t be telling the media [or anyone] that he intends to kill Woodmanese whether he intends to actually do it or not.

But, I hope that revenge is exacted and Woodmanese dies a death 10x more gruesome than the child he murdered, and the local police somehow turn a blind eye to the situation and let it fade away.[/quote]

I agree with you, but honestly I don’t think people like this killer feel things the way you and I do, and thus I don’t think theres any real gain in torturing them before you off them.

Honestly, this story wasn’t that bad. The kid was stabbed once and died. The kid who did it polished his bones and then tried to strangle someone else 9 years later. The killer was clearly an emotional abnormality where there is no line between “I wonder” and “dead”. Which is different than the sadistic abnormalities.

Much worse happens in the streets of major cities all the time.
[/quote]

Can’t tell if you’re serious or not, but I’ll address it anyway: Much worse DOES NOT happen in major cities “all the time”. Serial killers are pretty rare, and that’s exactly what this dude was heading towards. Yes, there’s senseless violence all of the time, but there is usually a reason other than “I wonder what it’s like to kill someone and watch them die”. The fact that he cleaned the bones and kept them as souvenirs showed that heenjoyed what he did and was waiting to strike again. If the other kid hadn’t of gotten away then this monster would’ve increased his attacks at an accelerated pace, guaranteed.

127

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
also, for anyone saying that they would kidnap their sons murderer and kill them… It would be REALLY hard to get away with. Especially the guys saying they’d keep him alive in the woods for days cause you would be one of the first people contacted by the police once the guy went missing (which would be pretty quickly since he would have to be checking in with a parole officer pretty regularly)

Just sayin[/quote]

Yes, that is why Random Joe Citizen will (hopefully) step up and save the father the trouble.[/quote]

Where is Dexter when we need him? LOL[/quote]

No need for a serial killer. Just an enterprising guy (or gal) with a cheap hunting rifle (that does not eject its shell), perhaps an unrifled shotgun, or a revolver close up.

Change your plates for another car of similar make & model. Drive normal. Make sure the registration is good.

Dispose of everything in various locations, weapon first, shower.

Don’t tell anyone.

128

SSC the individual piece of shit that commited this crime is a sociopath. Technically not a mental illness such as schizphrenia or bipolar. There is no medical treatment for his disorder, he will never change period. He is getting out for good behavior because sociopaths can reason and are highly intelligent. He is not delusional he knows if he plays the game he can get out early. HE WILL KILL AGAIN. Sorry just like pedofiles will molest a child again 100% of the time.

Emotionally parents have gone through a mental process that cannot be understood until you have experienced it. This is a valid point in the discussion. Can you have a discussion with a gay man about the joys of anal sex? If you are gay you of course can, however if you are not the ability to “understand” will not be there.

Could I kill some stranger who I knew for sure had killed and hurt a child? Yes. Could I kill and torture that individual? No. Being in the medical field for almost 20 years I could sure as hell come up with better ways than anyone on these boards believe me.

I worked ER trauma for 14 years. I think I put this story on here but I will do it again anyway.

One night cops brought in a guy who was fucking yelling combative etc. We knock him out and intubate him. Then the cops go on to tell of how they had a 4-6 hour hostage situation with this guy and his 2 year old daughter. He raped and strangled her and jumped out his 2nd story window to evade cops. My wife working at the childrens hospital and she got to take care of the child. She was of course crying and describing the mutalation of this child to me. I was also assigned to care for this piece of shit. Now I could have killed him very very easily and would have never been caught. All I had to do was inject 30 cc of regular insulin into his IV, nobody would have known how and why this guy was dying. And I stood in front of the fridge we kept the insulin for a good 20 minutes going over this in my head. I finally requested off the case and went home. AND I FUCKING CRIED MYSELF TO SLEEP.

Honestly I dont give two shits if you believe me. But if you are feeling randy go look up Corpus Christi caller times from the years between 2001-2005 cause I cant remember exactly which year it was.

130

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

…No need for a serial killer. Just an enterprising guy (or gal) with a cheap hunting rifle (that does not eject its shell), perhaps an unrifled shotgun, or a revolver close up…[/quote]

My understanding is that matching bullet rifling with a particular gun is much more difficult if not downright impossible than TV shows would have you to believe.[/quote]

and no matching at all with a shotgun

besides you can always ram your own rifle barrel with a file and there goes that problem if they find the rifle

132

neelydan would play quarters at a bar with irish or pushharder and thus is hesitant to weigh in on such a painful discussion…

“Justice” is the result of a covenant. Justice is when the consequences are expected and agreed-upon actions resultant to one breaking a covenant. Justice has little to do with morality. It is related instead to ethics.

Prison time for bank robbery is “justice.” A week on the county chain-gang or the electric chair for bank robbery would not be “justice.” We codify these things into law, and judicial precedent along with statute determines the consequence. “Justice” is a social contract wherein prohibited actions are met with predetermined consequences.

Vigilanteism is abhorrent, and the breaking of a covenant more significant, usually, than the “justice” the morons are trying to mete out. Are human beings capable of rising above vigilanteism? Of course not. Punch neelydan’s wife and see if he calls a cop. Nevertheless, it is paramount for an organized society to prohibit vigilanteism as best it can. It is one of the fundamental underpinnings of governance.

Any other form of “justice” is individual paradigm, and, basically, “fuck you.” Since neelydan thinks he is right and you think you are right, we can either kill each other or create a covenant.

133

[quote]DJHT wrote:
SSC the individual piece of shit that commited this crime is a sociopath. Technically not a mental illness such as schizphrenia or bipolar. There is no medical treatment for his disorder, he will never change period. He is getting out for good behavior because sociopaths can reason and are highly intelligent. He is not delusional he knows if he plays the game he can get out early. HE WILL KILL AGAIN. Sorry just like pedofiles will molest a child again 100% of the time.

Emotionally parents have gone through a mental process that cannot be understood until you have experienced it. This is a valid point in the discussion. Can you have a discussion with a gay man about the joys of anal sex? If you are gay you of course can, however if you are not the ability to “understand” will not be there.

Could I kill some stranger who I knew for sure had killed and hurt a child? Yes. Could I kill and torture that individual? No. Being in the medical field for almost 20 years I could sure as hell come up with better ways than anyone on these boards believe me.

I worked ER trauma for 14 years. I think I put this story on here but I will do it again anyway.

One night cops brought in a guy who was fucking yelling combative etc. We knock him out and intubate him. Then the cops go on to tell of how they had a 4-6 hour hostage situation with this guy and his 2 year old daughter. He raped and strangled her and jumped out his 2nd story window to evade cops. My wife working at the childrens hospital and she got to take care of the child. She was of course crying and describing the mutalation of this child to me. I was also assigned to care for this piece of shit. Now I could have killed him very very easily and would have never been caught. All I had to do was inject 30 cc of regular insulin into his IV, nobody would have known how and why this guy was dying. And I stood in front of the fridge we kept the insulin for a good 20 minutes going over this in my head. I finally requested off the case and went home. AND I FUCKING CRIED MYSELF TO SLEEP.

Honestly I dont give two shits if you believe me. But if you are feeling randy go look up Corpus Christi caller times from the years between 2001-2005 cause I cant remember exactly which year it was.

[/quote]

Damn… That’s rough man.

134

Gas soaked mummy wrap, book of matches.

Go for it, man!

136

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]dk44 wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]Oleena wrote:
You probably have several individuals living in your neighborhood who are more sadistic than this guy.

I doubt the killer will ever see what he did as more than a way to pass an afternoon. [/quote]

These two statements are complete bullshit. Do you just make up random things that you think and try to make them seem like facts?

“several individuals living in your neighborhood who are more sadistic than this guy”? Yeah Im sure half of his neighbors have murdered more than one little kid apiece. lol[/quote]

Big O lives in the hood son. She is a certified Crip homey G. She kills fo fee or free. G Unit Bitch. or, and this is a stretch, she is a dumbass. You pick.[/quote]

yeah the hoods of Washington (seattle probably)

The Pacific Northwest is real rough
[/quote]

This bitch is a seamstress of bullshit, weaving together facts, opinions and anectdotal references in an effort to appear intellectual and make a point. She’s a blithering fucking idiot and an attention whore. Merely acknowledging this internet tramp is akin to feeding the animals at the zoo - they will come to want more and more.

137

[quote]gregron wrote:
also, for anyone saying that they would kidnap their sons murderer and kill them… It would be REALLY hard to get away with. Especially the guys saying they’d keep him alive in the woods for days cause you would be one of the first people contacted by the police once the guy went missing (which would be pretty quickly since he would have to be checking in with a parole officer pretty regularly)

Just sayin[/quote]

If I could get him anywhere secluded I would. The woods is not a requirement. A fucking basement will do just fine. Period. But that is assuming I let him get out of prison. It’s very unlikely that I would wait even 10 years to get you. You’d likely die in prison and I could arrange that with little more difficulty than ordering a fucking pizza. What you are possibly sadly mistaken about is me acting on such a thing.

The problem is some of you motherfuckers (maybe not you Greg, I don’t know) do not have the proper constitution of a fucking man. Someone murders someone in your family? If you have the means and opportunity, you kill that motherfucker. Fuck jail and fuck the “law” too. End of story. I LOL at suggestions that some of us are “jerking off” on the internet fantisizing about what we’d do. Maybe some are, I don’t know and I don’t care.

I’m staring out the window right now at at least 3 people across the street that have guns tucked in their coats and I’ll be walking across the street shortly to get a drink. Did you ever stop to think that maybe some of us are acquainted with violence and the possiblity of life and death violence as part of our everday ordinary experience? Last week someone got shot two blocks away. A week later, one of his shooters was found dead in a burning building around the corner.

You kill one of mine, I WILL take you or one of yours.

138

[quote]pushharder wrote:
However, were you (and I know you wouldn’t - this is rhetorical) packing an “It’s not my kid. It’s not my town… it’s not really any of my goddamn business” mindset and presenting it as part of your argument you too would be banished to The Land of Irrelevancy.
[/quote]

The Land of Irrelevancy = PWI

139

[quote]Oleena wrote:
The killer in the OP was a sick puppy who doesn’t have the emotional capabilities to repent and should be put down. End of story. It’s not a shocker and happens more often than you think.

For the fuckers who say I’m trivializing the matter, let me give you a picture of what happens in MY backyard:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2004059973_abuse08m.html[/quote]

It’s so dangerous in Seattle.

Does this bat shit crazy bitch have any clue how fucking bat shit crazy she is?

140

[quote]NeelyDan wrote:
neelydan would play quarters at a bar with irish or pushharder and thus is hesitant to weigh in on such a painful discussion…

“Justice” is the result of a covenant. Justice is when the consequences are expected and agreed-upon actions resultant to one breaking a covenant. Justice has little to do with morality. It is related instead to ethics.

Prison time for bank robbery is “justice.” A week on the county chain-gang or the electric chair for bank robbery would not be “justice.” We codify these things into law, and judicial precedent along with statute determines the consequence. “Justice” is a social contract wherein prohibited actions are met with predetermined consequences.

Vigilanteism is abhorrent, and the breaking of a covenant more significant, usually, than the “justice” the morons are trying to mete out. Are human beings capable of rising above vigilanteism? Of course not. Punch neelydan’s wife and see if he calls a cop. Nevertheless, it is paramount for an organized society to prohibit vigilanteism as best it can. It is one of the fundamental underpinnings of governance.

Any other form of “justice” is individual paradigm, and, basically, “fuck you.” Since neelydan thinks he is right and you think you are right, we can either kill each other or create a covenant.
[/quote]

Well said. It’s a bad situation with a lot of shades of gray intertwined, but I tend to agree with all of this. Covenant it is!