Low T at 24, UK- Private Route

Pharma TRT
21

Okay guys, a quick update. I have come back from Disney, probably not the best place to visit when you have low t levels. Anyway, long story short, all this uncertainty was driving me mad. I have an appointment with an NHS GP on 4/02 but was hardly going to wait that long so I booked a private visit at a specialist clinic today. 120 quid later, I found out that my private specialist is a big proponent of SSRI and thought that my main issue is that I don’t enjoy life. He said that my t levels are fine because all the hormones look fine AND, get his, my T levels are just fine. His rationale even made sense at a time- he calculated the free unboound free t and said it was an excellent score. Thing is, I only realised once I have left the consultation room that he gave the score given was a percentage, not an actual value. Which means my body’s effective at converting t to free t which is a very welcome news but still doesn’t mean that my hormones are ok… the doc hinted I needed some counselling and perhaps an SSRII that would give me a boost. I wasn’t going argue with him because I have an appointment with an endo and I wasn’t going to ask for a trt trial at the private clinic if I can get it for free from NHS… Things got a bit heated though when he started blaming supps for the way I feel ‘They add anabolic steroids to supplements, not the best kind though, the less expensive one and less bio-available ones.’ I respectfully disagreed and pointed out that supplements do not elicit strong reaction in most people and they are nowhere near as much powerful as some of the stuff he was trying to peddle there. I also said that we cannot be sure if it is the depression that is causing low t levels and not the other way round. Oh well, I should have known better. half a day of work down the drain. I am really dreading now that appointment with my NHS endo.

As far as vits go, I started taking vit b complex again (jarrows b-right) and added iodine supp to my diet. I cannot handle vit C very well (it always makes me feel sluggish and edgy). Also, I pulled the trigger and got some high potency (1:200) tongat ali (remember reading a study one time about its potential to reverse hypogonadism) , mucuna pruriens (neurotransmitter support), maca (energy). I am going to stay on that regimen till my appointment with the endo and then will get my t level tested again- not that I hope that tongat ali will magically put me mid-range. On the other hand, the initial bloodwork was done late in the day (4:30ish) so if I get tested in the morning I’d expect to at least see my testosterone at the very bottom of the range

I noticed that I feel really good after a cheat meal day (massive pizza, chips, milk chocolate etc) which gets me thinking the whole issue might actually pertain to a neurotransmitter or dietary imbalance. I love tyrosine but you build up tolerance quickly, hopefully mucuna pruriens will be of help. I am not quite ready to jump onthe SSRI bandwagon (I cannot really afford any of the potential sides considering that even a slight dip in my already severely challenged performance might disrupt the proceedings of a conference)

22

@KS man I already take vit b12 (methylcobalamin) every morning (5 mg). I will let you know about the mid day body temp

23

@KS man I already take vit b12 (methylcobalamin) every morning (5 mg). I will let you know about the mid day body temp

24

Ok, body temp taken mid-day came back normal- 98 at 4 PM (GMT).

Do you think that clomid might be beneficial in my situation?

The only downside is that I will have to get it from an online pharmacy (apparently a decent site from what I read on the forums).

25

Use Nolvadex, not Clomid. But not yet.

Keep checking temperatures. Can GF get 98.6 with that thermometer?

Are you using iodized salt or sea salt?

26

She just checked in at 97.5 F at 5PM GMT. Why would it matter? I guess you are trying to determine whether the thermometer works well.
For comparison, my body temp was 96.26 F today (taken at the same time).

I just received a letter from the private doctor… Quite entertaining actually. I will post it whenever I have a spare while.

27

She just checked in at 97.5 F at 5PM GMT. Why would it matter? I guess you are trying to determine whether the thermometer works well.
For comparison, my body temp was 96.26 F today (taken at the same time).

I just received a letter from the private doctor… Quite entertaining actually. I will post it whenever I have a spare while.

28

[quote]KSman wrote:
Use Nolvadex, not Clomid. But not yet.

Keep checking temperatures. Can GF get 98.6 with that thermometer?

Are you using iodized salt or sea salt?

[/quote]
Yes, I do use sea salt on a regular basis. In fact, I tend to go for the organic sea salt which is naturally rich in minerals (http://www.tesco.com/groceries/Product/Details/?id=264504403)

My gf hit 98.8 today which I personally find quite surprising given that the reading was taken at 7PM (GMT) at the end of our 24h fast. My body temp came back at 97.7.

Below you will find some excerpts from the letter the private doc sent to me GP. Any feedback would be most welcome:

“problems: 1. low total t
2. lethargy and genera demotivation” - so far so good…

“obviously, although he has done well, he has been feeling lethargic and generally demotivated and has a bit of mild depression”- even though I did say I wasn’t depressed, just feeling down.

“I note you carried out a series of screening tests including haemoglobin of 15.2 with normal white cells and indices. renal and liver profile normal apart from a marginally elevated alt. thyroid function tests were normal, tsh 0.93, his hbA1c is normal ruling out glucose problems. He has normal prolactin but you found a low tesosterone of 7.9 though his SHGB is lowish at 22. he also had FSH at 6 and LH 4.1.”

“Obiously there was a question whether he had androgen deficiency, with with normal gonadttropins it rules out primary testicular problems because his gonadatrophins should be high then and pituirary hypogonadism because the FSH and LH should be much lower. In fact, when we calculate his free testosterone it is 2.21% the normal range is grater than 2 so he is well androgenised and nothing will be gained by giving him testosterone”. Now, that’s where I believe he went wrong- the way I see it my body is efficient at converting total t to free testosterone (hence the relatively high percentage) but it doesn’t mean that the amount of free t my body has to play with is high- 2.3% of 7.9= 0.1817

“I understand that his blood test was done about 2 pm. the standards are set at 9 am when t is at its highgest so it would probably be even better earlier in the day.”- you mean it could be three times as high? Because that’s what it should be for someone my age…

"X understands the concept of free hormones and that his free t is ideal’ - questionable, not to say cheeky.

"He does do some gym work and takes protein supps to help his body as well as Q10. He has never taken anabolic steroids in any form, though occasionally the protein supp has some form of androgen in which doesn’t register on the t assay, that might be another reason why his wasn’t within the normal range’.- oh, I see, you just nailed it doc. But hey, what about milk- it does contain anabolic hormones as well… (BTW I don’t eat diary products apart from the milk isolate powder)

"I have reassured him about the normality of his male hormone and he is still able to make love to his partner and has some libido, through perhaps is not at its best’- read: if you can make love to your partner you are probably just fine.

"I have reassured him that I didn’t thing there was any physical abnormality and that perhaps he should come to see you to discuss his emotional health.I even suggested he might benefit from an SSRI, but very appropriately he was worried that if he did go on that he might get some side effects, but none of them would be particularly severe and in any case, if he needed that treatment he would only go on it for a couple of months initially as a trial and it would be reversible’

I left out bits and bobs about SAD and the lack of sunshine around these parts.

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is it just me or the doc is refusing to engage with the issue here?

30

Yes, no excuse for confusing % free T with absolute.

31

the treatment, feedback and attitudes you are getting from drs is typical of nhs. if your test result are within “normal range” you have zero chance of receiving any prescibed medications imo.