Vroom,
From the top, a short reply.
“There are a lot of reasons to trample of freedom. We are at war. We need to protect our values. We need to protect lives. In order to do these things we are being told that we have to curtail freedoms.”
The problem with this is that freedoms aren’t being trampled. More on this later.
“The environmental groups are a proxy for nature, hoping to make sure that it is not forgotten in the scramble for the most important value these days… profits.”
I won’t rehash the arguments here, but environmental groups are not a proxy for nature - ask hunters and farmers.
Moreover, profits are not the most important ‘value’ today - but I suspect if you asked an unemployed worker, strong profits are a hell of a lot more important than saving the scuttlefish.
“Why do conservatives want to limit, attack and control all the checks and balances?”
Your list of ‘checks and balances’ is simplistic and wrong. Environmental groups aren’t a ‘check’ anymore than the NRA is - they are public groups trying to influence policy in one direction or the other. The ‘checks and balances’ are institutional. You’ve basically just identified a couple of groups close to your heart while ignoring the rest of ‘checks’ (under your definition.
“What is it that our conservatives are looking for? Do they just want the power to do whatever they want without consequences.”
Vroom, I beg you - educate yourself. Conservatives have always been distrustful of consolidated power, hence their overwhelming opposition to socialism. That last line “they just want power to do whatever they want without consequences” is not only false on its face and completely unsubstantiated by any conservative commentary available, it is actually the goal of 1960’s liberalism and social libertarianism to achieve the ‘absolute freedom without consequences’ utopia. Conservatives, routinely, are the ones warning that ‘ideas have consequences’, not the other way around. Vroom, you have never missed the mark so badly as with this comment.
Conservatives appreciate order, more specifically, ordered liberty. The goal of the conservative is to steer the craft between the twin evils of anarchy and tyranny. A moderate balancing act is the conservative’s ultimate goal.
“That damned media is always pointing out mistakes and endangering our policies. Those damned public interest groups are always endangering our almighty profits. Those damned citizens are always dissenting and disagreeing with policies. We have to control them all.”
Vroom, are you an agitated junio high schooler? These arguments are weak. Conservatives don’t mind the media - but it has to be fair and neutral - oh yeah, and of decent quality. Forget partisan politics for a minute - the quality of journalism is low.
As for ‘public interest groups’, who said anything about trying to shut them down? They can organize and speak their mind. Disagreeing with them and even working against them is not wanting to censor them, even though the Left can distinguish the two.
“I thought being a conservative meant that you wanted reduced government, fiscal responsibility and strong punishments for convicted criminals. On these boards it seems that conservatism is not about being conservative, but instead about being able to shirk off controls and responsibilities. Screw the environment. Screw the press. Screw the citizens. They are all putting limits on our policies and profits.”
More whiney rewarmed Marxism. First, you can’t make up your mind - are conservatives trying to control everyone as authoritarians or are they ‘shirking off controls and responsibilities’? Second, screw the press. It’s the press’s job to be good and trustworthy, not anybody else’s. And the profit thing - profits create jobs and pay for pensions, two things you should be concerned with.
“- Imposed foreign policies that spread hatred.”
Such as? Do tell me which ones were ‘imposed’.
“- Rampant disregard for the environment and the consequences thereof.”
You mean like subsidization of alternative fuel production and consumption?
“- Inability to stop terrorists from infiltrating the citizenry.”
Sound like a police state is required to accomplish this. Still can’t make up your mind, Vroom?
“- Inability to identify terrorists before they commit attrocities.”
See above. The Patriot Act helps this to some degree - you’re all for that, right?
“- Profiteering without respect for the law.”
Such as?
“Why are the conservatives, especially the ones here, always out looking for ways to attack the messenger?”
You assume the messenger is always right or always has a good message.
“Lets make the environmentalists or activists out to be the bad guys and then we can remove impediments to our profits.”
Vroom, I’m disappointed in this weak pseudo-socialist makeover manifesto you have here.
“While I’m all for a strong economy, that doesn’t mean we need to eliminate the ability for the public to voice lawful dissent when they are in strong disagreement with the way things are going.”
Dissent is alive and well, brother - in fact, it’s more than alive, it’s big business and quite the trendy thing to do. Why do you continue to squeal about the elimination of dissent when you prove - every single time you post something criticizing conservatives - that dissent is alive and well? Is this lost on you, Vroom?
“I’m going to go so far as to say that conservative values are no longer in line with American values. American values are about freedom.”
So are conservative values. Trying to paint conservatives as freedom-hating authoritarians will get you laughed out of most any place not named San Francisco. The history isn’t there, and post 9/11, the police state is a myth.
Which brings me to why you post such nonsense. Generally, it sounds like you crave that a police state is emerging, presuambly because you can award yourself cool points for being a wannabe revolutionary. Maybe you even have a beret.
But, paranoiac fanatasies aside, much hasn’t changed and conservatives are who they always were. American values are a mixture of liberal and conservative values. But I think it is faor to say that America is a moderate-conservative nation.
“About the citizen being empowered and protected against overbearing government. About the right to due process. About the right to practice your religion or lack thereof. About the right to bear arms. About the right to have a strong media to push back against the government of behalf of the citizen. About the right to assemble peacefully to protest the government or anything else.”
You should read the rest of the Constitution and not just the Bill of Rights. Very instructional.
“Well, I’m not interested in adopting your myopic viewpoint.”
Here’s a tissue and a tip, Vroom - you don’t have to, and conservatives don’t wnt to impose them on you.
“I’m going to make up my own mind and I’m going to point out every government misdeed that happens along the way.”
(sniff) Vroom, the whiney Crusader. You’ve lost me.
This has been a trip through a strange land that doesn’t exist. Conservatives aren’t trying to oppress thought or speech, nor are they trying to create a tyranny. They are willing to robustly debate what they think is important and are not afraid to ruffle a few feathers. If you haven’t the stomach for it, find another hobby.
