Labs After 3 Months on 250mg Sustanon/Wk

Pharma TRT
41

Of course I don’t have a muscle wasting disease,unless you call getting old, eventual sarcopenia a problem( I do think it is).My reason would be relief from joint pain. My old Dr who just retired was sympathetic to my situation and would probably have prescribed some for me, if it was still produced locally by big pharma. He still remembers when most Dr’s were happy to prescribe it for sporting purposes, as was Dbol, and oxandralone. They have less androgenic side effects than test. My new Dr would be a much harder proposition, getting a Deca script. The reason why most Dr’s won’t prescribe is not logical, genuine medical reasons, its that they don’t want to be investigated by the authorities, because they are illegal for performance enhancement in sport.

The fact that the-pharma companies no longer sell it locally, speaks more truth. Even with the conditions you mentioned, it still should be available locally, but its not. I haven’t heard of a more effective treatment, with a proven track record replacing Deca. Its definitely not SARMS. You can still easily get a script for them, from specialist clinics, but they are not as effective nor are they properly approved and thoroughly tested for human consumption. No wonder most people use UGL gear.

I don’t know about the practicality of an import permit, especially if you need to send paperwork each time you bring it in for personal use, then wait for it to get officialy approved. So many hoops to jump through its meant to make it hard and discourages most people.
I have brought it other stuff, that needed permits(not even prohibited),not medicine, and it required a shit ton of paperwork, federal and state permits, each and every time.

42

Did oxandrolone ever exist in Aus?

I’ve been told by some doctors here that testosterone and nandrolone used to be scripted out for various reasons. I believe the guy who runs andrology Australia is actually somewhat against testosterone replacement therapy… That’s where the batshit crazy 6nmol/l guideline comes from…

Same issue with acute and chronic pain in USA and Aus. Doctors terrified of prescribing painkillers

I have a family friend who has a crushed disk in her/his back (obviously needs surgery at this point). Severe, intractable pain… Her GP, and one surgeon tells her to take paracetamol. We aren’t even talking about chronic use, we are talking about use while waiting for surgery.

43

Track record backing up nandrolone decanoate is anecdotal. To my knowledge there is only one clinical trail looking at the “nandrolone helps with joint pain” debate.

The clinical trial was poorly designed, but nevertheless the eventuating conclusion was “nandrolone helps significantly”. Is it plausible nandrolone helps with joint pain? Yes

Is it more effective than say… biologics, surgery (if there is irreparable damage, say a full thickness RC tear), orthokine treatments etc (this all depends on what is causing the pain)… no

44

Horses for courses, in regard to specific cases. I wasn’t just including joint pain, but the wasting type diseases as well. Also surgery, and I’m guessing orthokine treatments are going to be more expensive than a script for deca. Even if you have surgery, some deca on the tail end will likely speed your recovery.
Clinically there may be only one official trial for Deca. That’s enough to convince a Dr into prescribing it though. All they are looking for is back up to justify it to authorities, so they don’t get into trouble.
Anecdotal or not, anybody that uses knows that deca, or EQ has as positive effect on your joints. I haven’t got anywhere near the same response from just test.

45

No doubt

I’ve had undergone four major surgical procedures over the past year

Recovery takes ages, with the added muscle wasting and whatnot i’d argue my recovery time could be cut down by around half if I were to use something… to note I make the decision to not use anything in the AAS department to expedite recovery outside of my TRT @100mg/wk.

Even that 100mg comes with distinct advantages.

  • you can take painkillers without developing hypogonadism. Outside of tapentadol, all opiate/opiod painkillers induce secondary hypogonadism if you are taking them repeatedly.
  • T levels are sustained at mid normal or so 24/7… even if you are sedentary, hardly sleeping due to pain and prolonged recovery times

All in all this means less muscle wasting. Deconditioning still occurs though.

There is a lot of data available suggesting AAS decreases recovery times following surgery. Back in the day apparently it wasn’t all that uncommon for people to be prescribed low doses of AAS to mitigate muscle wasting following major procedures.

Also a good body of data exists suggesting HGH may shorten recovery times. We still won’t see either being implemented if more targeted therapies are available… that and the stigma that exists (some validity but primarily mediated by sociopolitical agendas that began to unfold around the late 1980s)

Similar to painkillers… if HGH and AAS weren’t subject to a degree of regulation so stringent many physicians risk losing their licenses EVEN with appropriate prescribing doctors wouldn’t be nearly as hesitant to prescribe them.

My arguement is that Aus should decriminalise possession for personal use and legalising importation for personal use… stopping just short of legalising the products thus de facto enabling doctors to moniter patients without getting them in trouble. The laws aren’t stopping people from taking steroids, but many physicians are too scared to give forms for echocardiograms or provide blood tests for AAS users for fear of getting in trouble.

UK has the exact dynamic i’ve outlined above… and as a result clinics have popped up that allow for fairly liberal use of prescription TRT provided you actually need TRT (gotta go private though… but age doesn’t matter if you’ve actually got low T) and clinics exist specifically to moniter men who use higher doses… this allows men to get in and get out before they transition to full blown steroid induced cardiomyopathy, end stage renal disease etc.

Rescheduling them to S4 as opposed to S4 appendix D or S9 in NT and QLD (possession can =/= up to 20 years in prison… similar sentences are handed down for homicide) would also allow doctors to prescribe them for sarcopenia (Aus is looking at sarms for this… but the current sarms available don’t actually seem to be tissue selective…), cachexia etc again.

You can’t make tren legal… that’s absurd… but you can stop spending resources on ineffectively policing those who are stupid enough to take it, and you can create a dynamic that ultimately leads to considerably less burden on public healthcare sectors.

Do you really think a steroid user (esp in NT and QLD who is aware of the very harsh laws) cares about Australia’s steroid laws?

No… but i’d be willing to bet many would accept physician assisted monitering in the same manner by which we moniter smokers… and i’d be willing to bet many would stop using if they saw irreversible cardiac damage developing.

Ironically monitering smokers has led to less burden on healthcare sectors as some actually decide to quit when they’re informed of the risks and/or visibly see damage occuring via testing. I think you’d see the same dynamic unfold with steroids.

@Beyond_Beyond

46

EQ tanks E2 for many… this would predispose you to injury long term. Whatever EQ does in the short term is likely offset through long term use

Major concerns with nandrolone decanoate or nabdrolone phenylpropionate are neurological dysregulation and cardiac toxicity. Granted with brief use post op it’s not the end of the world

47

I never had that problem on EQ. I only ran it for cycles, not on all the time. Absolutely love the stuff, it is my favorite anabolic.

48

I’ve never taken EQ and thus can’t comment

It’s not something that seems to affect everyone.

Did you ever try primobolan (methenolone)? Also has the side effect of E2 suppression (almost universal), but otherwise known to be mild.

49

Yeah I did primo, or at least what was sold to me as UGL primo. It effected me a lot like test prop but not quite as painful. It was quite andogenic so it could have been masteron.
I didn’t feel like it was a miracle drug, like the hype. I used it for about 3 cycles, before trying EQ, then never looked back.

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