Kerry to Call for IMPEACHMENT

[quote]Joe Weider wrote:
Elk…I fail to see how my saying that I really do think vroom’s hit a low spot here is a sign of my being stuck at 13.

That being said, what the hell does it say about you when the best you can manage at any given time is to attack me based on shit of which you have no knowledge or evidence–and while I’m approaching you by trying my hardest to be polite and treat you with respect.

You’re coming across as a pretty small man, all things being equal.

And frankly, I grow increasingly weary of you and your blather.

Wake me when you have something to say that’s not based in la la land or parroting vroom.

[/quote]

I am not attacking you joe, I am confronting you with your childish behavior, for quite some time now. But, I see you rather then be real, want to be joe the entertainer for the most part.

Hey if it’s blather and beneath you, you don’t have to respond you can ignore it!

[quote]vroom wrote:
Is this your idea of a constructive post and rebuttal. Nice try vroom, but I stand by my assertions, and say let’s sit and wait and see whose thoughts, beliefs, opinions, and ideas prove themselves as accurate. You can disregard me all you want, that doesn’t make your fairy tale true or give it any more credence by attempting to belittle me.

Given our recent history it was a very reasonable post. I can see you wouldn’t like me asking you if you’d read it, or the fact that I questioned your judgement.

However, those are not huge massive insults that cannot be ignored. No, what really frosts you is that I’m not willing to accept your judgment as the obviously correct judgment.

I’m not making up any damned fairy tale. I’m not making any claims. I’m saying that it is fine that you have your opinion, but that doesn’t mean it is fact.

People don’t disagree with you much do they? Are you surrounded by yes men in your organization? Did you commit the sin of getting used to having everyone kissing your ass because you are their boss?[/quote]

I earned the repect of my peers. You would do well to try the same. I’ll try to judge each future post on its merit. Fair enough. It is not a good practice to taint future decisions given past ones.

I stand by my opinion wrt this thread and memo. Simple as that. No, you don’t have to agree and I’ve not once asked or tried to force that upon you. I have, quite simply, had my single opinion throughout. I’ve read your posts and could find nothing compelling to alter that view.

If something does come up that I feel evidentiary, I will then take that into consideration. And yes, like all reality, it is based on an individuals perception of the given info. We will probably disagree on what is evidence and what isn’t, but that to is reality.

Would you really consider a finely crafted letter to the editor evidence of your claims or even supportive info?

Would you take claims from Rush Limbaugh at face value? The info you passed on came from such, self-described ultra-liberal sources, that they lambasted the mainstream media as dim-witted and slow to take up their cause. The very same media that has been, I think, fairly portrayed as liberal biased. How far to the left can you go to try and find info that attempts to corroborate your hypothesis/opinion, based on a very suspect memo?

Honest questions?

Back to the ballgame. It’s gonna be a dandy

[quote]Joe Weider wrote:
so, has anyone heard if this impeachment thingy is still around?
[/quote]

Kerry never used the word impeachment nor did he ever imply it.

Nadar brought up the term impeachment and Al-Jazeera mixed them up.

Sure enough, NewsMucks funded by Saife jumped all over that and perpetuated something that never happened.

Do you want to wager on whether I am correct or not?

[quote]Would you really consider a finely crafted letter to the editor evidence of your claims or even supportive info?

Would you take claims from Rush Limbaugh at face value? The info you passed on came from such, self-described ultra-liberal sources, that they lambasted the mainstream media as dim-witted and slow to take up their cause. The very same media that has been, I think, fairly portrayed as liberal biased. How far to the left can you go to try and find info that attempts to corroborate your hypothesis/opinion, based on a very suspect memo?[/quote]

Of course not. It is something for people to read and form an opinion on, the letter to the editor that is.

I know you believe that the media has a liberal bias, but again, that is not commonly believed by all – so you can’t realistically present it as a conclusion and expect consensus. Neither should you based further statements on that conclusion if you want to have a constructive conversation.

I’m not making any claims at all with respect to the material I found, identified as liberally biased, and put on the site.

I don’t have a hypothesis, per se, but I am waiting to see, as I’ve said before, to see if anything does come out. However, I will suggest this, that if everyone dismissed things and never looked again, in the early stages, we’d never uncover scandals.

Clinton would never have been brought out if everyone would have said, but there is no proof, so stop looking into it. There is allegation. The allegations are serious. There is something that might possibly be seen as supportive evidence.

That, I’m afraid, no matter your opinion on the matter, is what gets people motivated enough to keep poking and prying into things to see whether or not there is something there.

Of course, conspiracy theorists may actually believe everything that comes down the pipeline, whether or not there is ever credible evidence to back it. I’m not saying that doesn’t happen, or that those same people aren’t involved in this. Of course they are. They always will be – on both sides of the aisle.

Anyhow, all that being said, the Boston Globe is at least a mainstream publication. You can probably read their story, ignore any slant you don’t like, and pull some facts out of the exercise. Just because something is slanted doesn’t mean you can’t extract useful details from it – assuming of course it actually includes such details.

So, I’m not making any claims. Read the material. Criticise it. Ignore it. Throwing it out without saying anything other than it is clearly biased shows absolutely nothing to anyone, except that you believe it is biased. Fair enough, but some type of analysis or crtiticism of the material would give your statement more weight – because, and this isn’t an insult, you too are biased.

Why should anyone believe your opinion? Why should anyone believe mine?

[quote]Elkhntr1 wrote:
Joe, I got to admit you don’t really do it to me until, I interject myself between, as you point out, something between you and Vroom.

It’s that namby pamby game you play with Vroom that annoys me. I am not the key master and can’t tell you what to do, but if you care to get along don’t play that game.

Usually people have a strong dislike for those they can’t box into a place where they can “win the argument”.

That’s why many of your like minded friends can’t stand ProfX or Vroom, because as Vroom pointed out about X before, they stick to logic.

Zeb, who I admire as a very intelligent and principled man still cannot desist from his smear tactics when he runs into a person with an opposing political viewpoint.

He then has a few underlings who attempt to play this same game, but they can’t even play it as well as Zeb does.

Zebs smearing attempts of Vroom don’t work on those except the rabid cheerleaders who will eat anything up that comes from the right.

Some on the right then try to manipulate me by saying “oh you are above that don’t express yourself that way”. What they really are doing is playing the we’ll offer you some positive/negative affirmation to manipulate you into being quite.

As vroom said stick to the debate not pussy veiled put downs or smears or slanders. Afford those of us who disagree with your view that and we will do our best to reciprocate.[/quote]

Um…Elk…maybe you better think twice before you hit the post button.

I called vroom a liberal…if that is smearing someone then I’m guilty, but I don’t think it is. He is a liberal and he admits it.

That should be the end of the topic.

LOL, among other things. I suspect that isn’t what Elk is referring to…

[quote]vroom wrote:
I called vroom a liberal…

LOL, among other things. I suspect that isn’t what Elk is referring to…

[/quote]

When it comes to “mischaracterizations” I think you are the king!

For example, it is you who miscaharacterized my view on Gays.

Whewwww…glad to see this thread “may” be dead! You guys should be all bloody and bruised from the mortal combat! It was entertaining though…

Donnie…

Issue getting MAJOR legs.
Also “Liberal media” exposed… as NOT.

Ministers were told of need for Gulf war ‘excuse’
The Sunday Times - Britain
June 12, 2005

The briefing paper, for participants at a meeting of Blair?s inner circle on July 23, 2002, said that since regime change was illegal it was ‘necessary to create the conditions’ which would make it legal.

Frustrated at the refusal by the White House to respond to their letter, the congressmen have set up a website - www.downingstreetmemo.com - to collect signatures on a petition demanding the same answers.

Conyers promised to deliver it to Bush once it reached 250,000 signatures. By Friday morning it already had more than 500,000 with as many as 1m expected to have been obtained when he delivers it to the White House on Thursday.

The complaints of media self-censorship have been backed up by the ombudsmen of The Washington Post, The New York Times and National Public Radio, who have questioned the lack of attention the minutes have received from their organisations.

Bush’s Iraq WMDs joke backfires
BBC
26 March, 2004
US President George W Bush has sparked a political row by making a joke about the failure to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

“Those weapons of mass destruction have got to be here somewhere.”

Is Lying About The Reason For War An Impeachable Offense?
By JOHN W. DEAN
Jun. 06, 2003

Worse than Watergate? A Potential Huge Scandal If WMDs Are Still Missing

Krugman is right to suggest a possible comparison to Watergate. In the three decades since Watergate, this is the first potential scandal I have seen that could make Watergate pale by comparison. If the Bush Administration intentionally manipulated or misrepresented intelligence to get Congress to authorize, and the public to support, military action to take control of Iraq, then that would be a monstrous misdeed.

To put it bluntly, if Bush has taken Congress and the nation into war based on bogus information, he is cooked. Manipulation or deliberate misuse of national security intelligence data, if proven, could be “a high crime” under the Constitution’s impeachment clause. It would also be a violation of federal criminal law, including the broad federal anti-conspiracy statute, which renders it a felony “to defraud the United States, or any agency thereof in any manner or for any purpose.”

“Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event - like a new Pearl Harbor.”

Rebuilding America’s Defenses
Project for the New American Century
Sept 2000

Impeachment doesn’t do any good anyway. Clinton was officially impeached and he stated in office. So what’s the point?

Kerry is just grandstanding because he is a loser!

Well,

The media, congress, the world have spoken—or not as the case may be.

Much ado about nothing!

Move on to your next crusade Bush haters.