Nice try, but the Republican Party is pointing to Kerry’s 35 years in public service, as the basis for saying he’s a flip-flopper.
He can’t be both ‘consistently liberal’ and consistently flip-flopping. The claims contradict each other.
One of the charges is just mud-slinging. Which one?
[quote]rainjack wrote:
For the war. Against the war. For the 87 billion for Iraq. Against the 87 billion for Iraq.
[/quote]
For the war when the “proof” was provided by the Bush administration.
Against the war when the “proof” turned out to be bunk.
Re: $87 Billion – wasn’t this quote taken out of context and wasn’t he actually referring to two different versions of the $87 billion increase?
Lewis Black: “STOP IT!”
[quote]Lumpy wrote:
Nice try, but the Republican Party is pointing to Kerry’s 35 years in public service, as the basis for saying he’s a flip-flopper.
He can’t be both ‘consistently liberal’ and consistently flip-flopping. The claims contradict each other.
One of the charges is just mud-slinging. Which one?[/quote]
Actually, Lumpy,
You’re creating a false dichotomy. This isn’t an either/or item, in that “liberal” and “flip-flopper” aren’t mutually exclusive.
For one, there is a time differential. A more thorough version of the complaints would be:
Kerry was rated as the single most liberal Senator in last year’s rating by that liberal organization that rates those in Congress based on their votes on issues that the organization has a position on, and has consistently scored very high in that same yearly study [Sorry - can’t remember the name of the organization right now, but I’ll look it up if you want to dispute whether it’s a liberal org];
Kerry has “flip-flopped” on his previous positions on certain contentious issues since he has been campaigning, and his target audience has changed from the people of Massachusetts, one of the most liberal states in the nation, to a national audience that requires him to appeal more to the “swing states” and their centrist voters.
Obviously, those are not mutually exclusive, so your premise that they are is wrong, which makes your conclusion wrong.
BB,
I believe it is the National Journal, considered non-partisan. Americans for Democratic Action (ADA) also does a ranking and is a liberal partisan outfit.
According to ADA, Kerry has the highest lifetime average for liberal voting among Massachusetts Senators, a 92 out of 100. That’s higher than Ted “Chappaquiddick” Kennedy, who is ranked at 90.
The late Senator Wellstone had a career average of 99. Schumer of NY has an average of 98.
Again, this is a different source than the one being quoted in the media, but it makes for an interesting alternative source.
And for kicks, other notables:
Boxer of CA has a 96, Edwards of NC has an 88.
McCain has an average of 9 - and Kerry and some Democrats thinks he’d be a good fit switching parties.
Right side up, I got a question for you…If going to the War in Iraq is all bunk, and was not needed. Then why did one of the top ranking Democrats Senator Joe Libermman (and I stated this speech in posting) time and time again that this war was needed. And necessary? Why did the press and media not even mention or talk about this speech? Or give him a interview on this speech?
Number 2 question for you… Why is it that the press and media are not bringing out all the good that is being done in Afghanistan and Iraq? I have friends that have served in Iraq and Afghanistan, and they paint a total different picture than what so amny are saying. One of them actually goes with the press corps. Shows them things, tells them things …And he has told me time after time, he tells them one thing and when there story airs or in some sort of printed media, it is totally different. Nothing with what they were shown or told.
Lieberman Calls Fight Against Terrorism in Iraq a ?War of Values?
And Warns of the Potential for a New ?Evil Empire?
Here is the Senator’s Press Release on the speech:
http://lieberman.senate.gov/newsroom/release.cfm?id=222671
Here is the actual speech itself:
http://lieberman.senate.gov/newsroom/release.cfm?id=222668
Ahhh you think the Democrats at their convention would allow him to sepak???
You think what he is saying is allot of bunk?
IN reference to Kerry and Edwards being the most LIberal Democratic candidates, the website that is saying this is the Americans for Democratic Action. ANd this is the website:
This is the ranking for Kerry:
MA U.S. Senate Jr John Forbes Kerry Democrat 90
Now the ranking for Edwards:
NC U.S. Senate Sr John Reid Edwards Democrat 85
Also here is the link to their voting records on each of the major issues and how they voted and what they stand for…AND you can see how they are flip flopping on major issues…Abssolutely everything is spelled out on this site… Nothing is pre fabricated on here or made up. This is a ll truth…
John Edwards:
The Voter's Self Defense System
John Kerry
Now time to lace up the Chucks and hit the gym!!
Impossible is Nothing!!
Joe
Thunderbolt:
Thanks for pulling the proper facts for me. =-)
Lumpy,
One can flip flop from one liberal stance to another. One can also be for something conservative then flip back and actually vote for something far more liberal.
It’s medication time, Lumpy!
Boys, I don’t even know why we bother posting at all when Lumpy is here to feed us the straight skinny and nothing but. Yeah.
You of all people shouldn’t be calling any one else “dopes.”
Not to rain on your Edwards parade, but Dan Quayle, yes, that guy, had a much more extensive record in the Senate than Edwards. Why next to Edwards, Quayle, villified by the Demos for his youth and inexperience, looked like the very center of gravitas.
That whole self-made, looks out for the little guy trial lawyer thing doesn’t look so good on closer inspection. Thomas Sowell, who acutally has studied and knows more things than you think you do, wrote a very interesting piece on one of the Breck Girl’s cases. Turns out that the research showed Edwards got the judgement for something that would have happened anyway, beyond the hospitals control. I’m not sure that spinning yarns for twelve hand-picked idiots classifies as earning anything, but if you say so…
By the way, and maybe BB can verify this, trial lawyers make their clients, you know, the little guys, pay their share of the taxes on the judgements. Out for the little guy indeed.
I agree with BB- smart choice to line up corporate money against you. But, on the other hand, trial lawyers, and curiously enough the people around them, shovel tons of cash at the Democrats, so who knows? Oh, I’m sorry, Lumpy does! His decoder ring tells him who is in fact running the White House and what he commands Dubbya to do.
You must be a very busy man, Lumpy-investigative reporter, historian, pollster, political adviser, constitutional lawyer, soothsayer, mindreader- it just doesn’t stop.
By the way, when you’re watching the debate, make sure you turn up the sound(not that you could make sense of what they are saying).
By the way, Lumpy, did Kerry get the usual 10-15 point bump in the polls from his pick?