Interrogation of Muslim Cartoon Publisher

[quote]Chushin wrote:
orion wrote:
The law prohibits … insult, contempt against a church or religious society, or public incitement against a group based on race, nationality, or ethnicity, if that incitement poses a danger to public order.

Based on this, the “Islamic cartoons” could clearly be against the law.

  1. No question but that they were seen as an “insult” by many.

  2. The reaction of thousands of Muslims around the world was evidence that the “insult” posed “a danger to public order.”

If you want to argue that the laws aren’t enforced, that’s fine. But clearly there ARE legal restrictions on the books when it comes to “freedom of speech.”
[/quote]

Typical Orion.

“We don’t have laws like that in Europe! In fact here is the law that is exactly like that. See? It is nothing like that!”

He argues just to argue.

[quote]Chushin wrote:
But don’t expect the whole world to know that fact, OK, Adolph?[/quote]

Wow!

Just as you think Chushin’s IQ can’t drop further…

[quote]orion wrote:
Chushin wrote:
orion wrote:
The law prohibits … insult, contempt against a church or religious society, or public incitement against a group based on race, nationality, or ethnicity, if that incitement poses a danger to public order.

Based on this, the “Islamic cartoons” could clearly be against the law.

  1. No question but that they were seen as an “insult” by many.

  2. The reaction of thousands of Muslims around the world was evidence that the “insult” posed “a danger to public order.”

If you want to argue that the laws aren’t enforced, that’s fine. But clearly there ARE legal restrictions on the books when it comes to “freedom of speech.”

Not public order somewhere around the globe, public order in Austria.

Like yelling fire in a crowded theater, only on a larger scale.

We also have laws against libel and slander.

So in a way there are restrictions, yes.

Then, the freedom of speech, art and research are part of our constitution, derogating the law above, plus in this case, as a politician, she might even be immune against a prosecution.

[/quote]

Sounds like your in need of a white flag to wave…

http://www.salon.com/...laws/index.html

UPDATE: Law Professor David Bernstein previously noted that Canada’s hate speech laws have had unintended consequences, as such laws inevitably do:

Moreover, left-wing academics are beginning to learn firsthand what it’s like to have their own censorship vehicles used against them. For example, University of British Columbia Prof. Sunera Thobani, a native of Tanzania, faced a hate-crimes investigation after she launched into a vicious diatribe against American foreign policy. Thobani, a Marxist feminist and multiculturalism activist, had remarked that Americans are “bloodthirsty, vengeful and calling for blood.” The Canadian hate-crimes law was created to protect minority groups from hate speech. But in this case, it was invoked to protect Americans.

Just like Bush followers who bizarrely think that the limitless presidential powers they’re cheering on will only be wielded by political leaders they like, many hate speech law proponents convince themselves that such laws will only be used to punish speech they dislike. That is never how tyrannical government power works.
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[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
Chushin wrote:
orion wrote:
The law prohibits … insult, contempt against a church or religious society, or public incitement against a group based on race, nationality, or ethnicity, if that incitement poses a danger to public order.

Based on this, the “Islamic cartoons” could clearly be against the law.

  1. No question but that they were seen as an “insult” by many.

  2. The reaction of thousands of Muslims around the world was evidence that the “insult” posed “a danger to public order.”

If you want to argue that the laws aren’t enforced, that’s fine. But clearly there ARE legal restrictions on the books when it comes to “freedom of speech.”

Typical Orion.

“We don’t have laws like that in Europe! In fact here is the law that is exactly like that. See? It is nothing like that!”

He argues just to argue.[/quote]

§ 283 StGB Verhetzung

Gesetzestext (Berücksichtigter Stand der Gesetzgebung: 01. Jänner 2007)

(1) Wer öffentlich auf eine Weise, die geeignet ist, die öffentliche Ordnung zu gefährden, zu einer feindseligen Handlung gegen eine im Inland bestehende Kirche oder Religionsgesellschaft oder gegen eine durch ihre Zugehörigkeit zu einer solchen Kirche oder Religionsgesellschaft, zu einer Rasse, zu einem Volk, einem Volksstamm oder einem Staat bestimmte Gruppe auffordert oder aufreizt, ist mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren zu bestrafen.

(2) Ebenso ist zu bestrafen, wer öffentlich gegen eine der im Abs. 1 bezeichneten Gruppen hetzt oder sie in einer die Menschenwürde verletzenden Weise beschimpft oder verächtlich zu machen sucht.

but

Art 10 EMRK (part of the Austrian constitution)

(1) Jeder hat Anspruch auf freie Meinungsäu�?erung. Dieses Recht schlie�?t die Freiheit der Meinung und die Freiheit zum Empfang und zur Mitteilung von Nachrichten oder Ideen ohne Eingriff öffentlicher Behörden und ohne Rücksicht auf Landesgrenzen ein. Dieser Artikel schlie�?t nicht aus, da�? die Staaten Rundfunk-, Lichtspiel- oder Fernsehunternehmen einem Genehmigungsverfahren unterwerfen.

(2) Da die Ausübung dieser Freiheiten Pflichten und Verantwortung mit sich bringt, kann sie bestimmten, vom Gesetz vorgesehenen Formvorschriften, Bedingungen, Einschränkungen oder Strafdrohungen unterworfen werden, wie sie im Gesetz vorgeschrieben und in einer demokratischen Gesellschaft im Interesse der nationalen Sicherheit, der Aufrechterhaltung der Ordnung und der Verbrechensverhütung, des Schutzes der Gesundheit und der Moral, des Schutzes des guten Rufes oder der Rechte anderer, um die Verbreitung von vertraulichen Nachrichten zu verhindern oder das Ansehen und die Unparteilichkeit der Rechtsprechung zu gewährleisten, unentbehrlich sind.

plus Art 13 StGG, also part of the constitution

Jedermann hat das Recht, durch Wort, Schrift, Druck oder durch bildliche Darstellung seine Meinung innerhalb der gesetzlichen Schranken frei zu äu�?ern. Die Presse darf weder unter Zensur gestellt, noch durch das Konzessions-System beschränkt werden. Administrative Postverbote finden auf inländische Druckschriften keine Anwendung.

See also Jerusalem against Austria and Oberschlick against Austria.

To make it very short:

Such laws, and the exact words can hardly translated into English forbid defamations, public degradations and only insofar as they are able to incite a riot, or come very close to it.

Since they need to bee seen in the light of our constitution that means you would probably have to whip a crowd into lynching somebody.

I have not found one ruling concerning that law.

The law I cited, §188 StGB is the one you are really looking for.

If you would like to go into this, be prepared to discuss laws concerning hate crimes next. They follow the same logic, are far worse, and we do not have such laws.

So, to sum it up.

This law is not exactly like this.

I never claimed there where no restrictions on free speech, only that it is alive and well.

US restrictions on free speech are worse.

Mmmmm´kay?

[quote]Chushin wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:

“We don’t have laws like that in Europe! In fact here is the law that is exactly like that. See? It is nothing like that!”

Ha ha! That’s really funny, Zap! You’ve got him down pretty well!
[/quote]

The law you have chosen to make a point is not the one you want.

I´ve posted the one you need.

If you think this is a serious problem, with the zero point something cases each year, I´d look at similar laws in the US.

[quote]Chushin wrote:
orion wrote:
Chushin wrote:
orion wrote:

Jesus, stick to the denial of the Holocaust where you have a point-

If an Austrian public official in such a case tells you that he “will look into it”, he is telling you in a polite way to forget it.

“Jesus?” Poor attitude there, son.

Maybe next time you should hand out “Bizarre Austrian Usage of English” dictionaries if you expect us silly native speakers to understand that “If an Austrian public official in such a case tells you that he “will look into it”, he is telling you in a polite way to forget it.”

Man, you’re an arrogant knucklehead!

That may be, but unfortunately not all cultures work the same as the enlightened American one.

Judging them by American standards is bound to lead to misunderstandings.

You’re a pompous, bigoted, ethnocentric idiot. (Yeah, I know; no news there!) It has nothing to do with “American standards” (enlightened though they may be). If words mean something other than their face value in your culture so be it. But don’t expect the whole world to know that fact, OK, Adolph?[/quote]

Because public officials always say exactly what they mean in the US?

Ok Einstein, I can see why you are confused.

[quote]pat36 wrote:
orion wrote:
Chushin wrote:
orion wrote:
The law prohibits … insult, contempt against a church or religious society, or public incitement against a group based on race, nationality, or ethnicity, if that incitement poses a danger to public order.

Based on this, the “Islamic cartoons” could clearly be against the law.

  1. No question but that they were seen as an “insult” by many.

  2. The reaction of thousands of Muslims around the world was evidence that the “insult” posed “a danger to public order.”

If you want to argue that the laws aren’t enforced, that’s fine. But clearly there ARE legal restrictions on the books when it comes to “freedom of speech.”

Not public order somewhere around the globe, public order in Austria.

Like yelling fire in a crowded theater, only on a larger scale.

We also have laws against libel and slander.

So in a way there are restrictions, yes.

Then, the freedom of speech, art and research are part of our constitution, derogating the law above, plus in this case, as a politician, she might even be immune against a prosecution.

Sounds like your in need of a white flag to wave…[/quote]

Yeah, his sharp legal mind has beat me with his interpretation of half a translation of a law presented without its legal context.