If You're a Black American...

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
61

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]csulli wrote:

By getting the fuck outta there didn’t you also not want to make the degeneration of your town your business and not take control of the neighborhood problems for the betterment of your local community? :stuck_out_tongue: I’m not saying you should have.
[/quote]

No. Given that there is absolutely no economic or professional opportunity for what I wanted to do in life there, I took out student loans, worked full time and put myself through college, then moved to where there were opportunities. In other words, I took ‘personal responsibility’. That town is not my problem to the extent that I don’t live there (I still have friends and family there).

I am involved in the community where I live and raise my children.[/quote]

I was really just messing with ya.

62

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
People need to take control of their neighborhoods.

[/quote]
How? [/quote]

How not?

If you know drug deals are taking place at the end of your driveway what would YOU do?

Where do you think community change starts?

[/quote]

When I lived in the ghetto, I would do nothing as there was nothing I could do that would change it. Call the cops? OK. Maybe the dealers (street level) get arrested then what? They are back on the streets before too long and/or someone else takes over. There was nothing I could do to keep drugs or guns out of where I lived. The DEA, FBI, and local police couldn’t stop the gangs, violence and drug flow so I don’t know what individuals can do.

In the suburbs where I grew up, and currently live, drug deals would not happen at the end of my drive way in the first place.

63

[quote]therajraj wrote:
If you didn’t grow up in a single mother household I would consider your examples invalid [/quote]

64

[quote]Airtruth wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
Feels like the US government has failed this group of people.
[/quote]

Why is Chicago’s violence the US Government’s problem?

Technically, Washington DC’s violence might the US Govt’s problem to deal with (if it’s “government’s” business at all).

Why isn’t it 's neighborhood’s problem? Action starts with local communities. People need to take control of their neighborhoods.

I grew up in a pretty nasty poor rural area. It actually made the top 100 most violent towns in the US. I got the fuck out of there. I can tell you it’s the way it is because of a general apathy about the locals. They don’t want to make the degeneration of their town their business. They turn their heads and then complain that “someone should do something”.

WTF is “The US Government” going to do?

Referenced list: NeighborhoodScout’s Most Dangerous Cities - 2022 - NeighborhoodScout
[/quote]

Why have a government? why not have a thousand city-states?
[/quote]

Last I knew, the “Federal” government comprised 50 “states”, which in turn created legal sub-entities called “Counties” which in turn comprise “towns/cities/boroughs, etc”, each with their own ‘government bureaucracy’ to deal with local issues, including local economic policies and police forces.

So, tell me again why the US Federal Government should “do something” about crime in some shitty neighborhood, in some town, in some county, in some state? Is there some US military action that needs to be taken?

65

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
People need to take control of their neighborhoods.

[/quote]
How? [/quote]

How not?

If you know drug deals are taking place at the end of your driveway what would YOU do?

Where do you think community change starts?

[/quote]

When I lived in the ghetto, I would do nothing as there was nothing I could do that would change it. Call the cops? OK. Maybe the dealers (street level) get arrested then what? They are back on the streets before too long and/or someone else takes over. There was nothing I could do to keep drugs or guns out of where I lived. The DEA, FBI, and local police couldn’t stop the gangs, violence and drug flow so I don’t know what individuals can do.

In the suburbs where I grew up, and currently live, drug deals would not happen at the end of my drive way in the first place.
[/quote]

I know nothing about your particular situation. Were you an adult then? Where were the adults? The heads of families? Did you know your neighbors? Your neighbors neighbors?

There are many examples of places that took their neighborhoods back.

66

[quote]therajraj wrote:
If you didn’t grow up in a single mother household I would consider your examples a false equivocation [/quote]

Are you suggesting that a single mother is powerless to take action in her community? Single mothers can only be helpless victims?

If so— Bull-fucking-shit.

67

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
If you didn’t grow up in a single mother household I would consider your examples a false equivocation [/quote]

Are you suggesting that a single mother is powerless to take action in her community? Single mothers can only be helpless victims?

If so— Bull-fucking-shit.

[/quote]

Yes.

The data says otherwise. Matriarchal households produce criminals and sexually promiscuous women at insane rates.

Single moms are anti-society

68

Actually not powerless, but incapable. Women need men and vise-versa to properly rear children.

No wonder a father was a common request at Christmas from children

69

http://www.photius.com/feminocracy/facts_on_fatherless_kids.html

70

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
People need to take control of their neighborhoods.

[/quote]
How? [/quote]

How not?

If you know drug deals are taking place at the end of your driveway what would YOU do?

Where do you think community change starts?

[/quote]

When I lived in the ghetto, I would do nothing as there was nothing I could do that would change it. Call the cops? OK. Maybe the dealers (street level) get arrested then what? They are back on the streets before too long and/or someone else takes over. There was nothing I could do to keep drugs or guns out of where I lived. The DEA, FBI, and local police couldn’t stop the gangs, violence and drug flow so I don’t know what individuals can do.

In the suburbs where I grew up, and currently live, drug deals would not happen at the end of my drive way in the first place.
[/quote]

I know nothing about your particular situation. Were you an adult then? Where were the adults? The heads of families? Did you know your neighbors? Your neighbors neighbors?

There are many examples of places that took their neighborhoods back.
[/quote]
I lived in the ghetto, I guess inner city is the more PC term, as an adult for around 5 years. It’s easy for many to say what they would do if they lived there or what those who live there should do (and I was probably guilty of that as well) however, if you actually immerse yourself in that reality your mind will change. The roots of the problem are very deep. And it’s one thing to take a neighborhood back and another to take an entire city back.

71

[quote]csulli wrote:
Fast forward through all the civil rights stuff, and the reason that black people are still disproportionately represented in the lower income demographics no longer has anything to do with their race, but it has to do with the fact that the people who start out poor tend to stay there. The higher percentage of minorities is incidental. It’s simply a factor of where they were forced to start out, and the fact that regardless of what color your skin is, most lower income people tend to stay that way.

The “failing” of the government is to poor people, not black people. And I would actually agree that the government has failed these low income folks with the way welfare is run in this country. I’m not touting letting people suffer and die without help, but the fast and loose hand with which welfare programs are run in this country seems to create a government dependance, incentivize laziness, encourage irresponsibility, and rob people of a fulfilling and productive life. I do think that is the government’s fault.[/quote]

This is an excellent post.

And it is a fact that poor people tent to make choices that reinforce their poverty and as you said, results in them staying that way.

72

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
If you didn’t grow up in a single mother household I would consider your examples a false equivocation [/quote]

Are you suggesting that a single mother is powerless to take action in her community? Single mothers can only be helpless victims?

If so— Bull-fucking-shit.

[/quote]

Yes.

The data says otherwise. Matriarchal households produce criminals and sexually promiscuous women at insane rates.

Single moms are anti-society
[/quote]

I think you’re missing my point and making it at the same time.

The statistics show what they are, not what they’re capable of. Poor urban areas, high crime. Yes, the statistics show it, but that is not ‘a solution’.

73

[quote]Alpha F wrote:

And it is a fact that poor people (tend) to make choices that reinforce their poverty and as you said, results in them staying that way.
[/quote]

Personal.responsibility.

This is what kids need to be taught.

  • Personal responsibility
  • Make Good Choices
  • Learn From Bad Choices
74

[quote]therajraj wrote:Yes.

The data says otherwise. Matriarchal households produce criminals and sexually promiscuous women at insane rates.

Single moms are anti-society
[/quote]Very good Raj. I would not say that single Moms are anti society by intention though and I don’t think you were saying that either. With all deference to Steely. No, they are by and large NOT capable of better and aren’t supposed to be. Exceptions do not make rules. The disintegration of faithful families as normative is THE defining issue here from a sociological standpoint. Faithful families can survive anything TOGETHER and do and have.

75

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:Yes.

The data says otherwise. Matriarchal households produce criminals and sexually promiscuous women at insane rates.

Single moms are anti-society
[/quote]Very good Raj. I would not say that single Moms are anti society by intention though and I don’t think you were saying that either. With all deference to Steely. No, they are by and large NOT capable of better and aren’t supposed to be. Exceptions do not make rules. The disintegration of faithful families as normative is THE defining issue here from a sociological standpoint. Faithful families can survive anything TOGETHER and do and have.
[/quote]

I do not disagree with your post except to say that, yes, they are capable, albeit not in the most optimal way.

Without getting too far off track, single mothers are part of a community. It takes a community to take the community back from crime and violence. That is the point I’m making.

76

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]csulli wrote:

By getting the fuck outta there didn’t you also not want to make the degeneration of your town your business and not take control of the neighborhood problems for the betterment of your local community? :stuck_out_tongue: I’m not saying you should have.
[/quote]

No. Given that there is absolutely no economic or professional opportunity for what I wanted to do in life there, I took out student loans, worked full time and put myself through college, then moved to where there were opportunities. In other words, I took ‘personal responsibility’. That town is not my problem to the extent that I don’t live there (I still have friends and family there).

I am involved in the community where I live and raise my children.[/quote]

I was really just messing with ya.[/quote]

I thought it was a very valid question and it gave SteelyD the opening to expand on why he made that choice.

In line with what you already stated that poor people tend make choices that keep them that way, by leaving a broken down neighborhood he proves that he breaks from that cycle of choices for himself.

He can then serve as an example to those other minorities that want to do something but can’t because they are outnumbered by the complacent members of the area.

I also believe that ultimately, by leaving a bad situation you can accelerate change.
If all law abiding citizens left, only the drug dealers and the addicts would remain.

What would be of the current welfare system if all tax payers left and only the government and the welfare beneficiaries remained?

It is the difference between enabling people and empowering people.
Empowering others has to start with the individual self having what it takes to step out of preprogrammed choices.

Get out to get strong.

It means breaking out from the shackles of emotional sloth - apathy is the antithesis of effort.

77

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]Alpha F wrote:

And it is a fact that poor people (tend) to make choices that reinforce their poverty and as you said, results in them staying that way.
[/quote]

Personal.responsibility.

This is what kids need to be taught.

  • Personal responsibility
  • Make Good Choices
  • Learn From Bad Choices
    [/quote]

I agree completely.

78

[quote]Alpha F wrote:

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]csulli wrote:

By getting the fuck outta there didn’t you also not want to make the degeneration of your town your business and not take control of the neighborhood problems for the betterment of your local community? :stuck_out_tongue: I’m not saying you should have.
[/quote]

No. Given that there is absolutely no economic or professional opportunity for what I wanted to do in life there, I took out student loans, worked full time and put myself through college, then moved to where there were opportunities. In other words, I took ‘personal responsibility’. That town is not my problem to the extent that I don’t live there (I still have friends and family there).

I am involved in the community where I live and raise my children.[/quote]

I was really just messing with ya.[/quote]

I thought it was a very valid question and it gave SteelyD the opening to expand on why he made that choice.

In line with what you already stated that poor people tend make choices that keep them that way, by leaving a broken down neighborhood he proves that he breaks from that cycle of choices for himself.

He can then serve as an example to those other minorities that want to do something but can’t because they are outnumbered by the complacent members of the area.

I also believe that ultimately, by leaving a bad situation you can accelerate change.
If all law abiding citizens left, only the drug dealers and the addicts would remain.

What would be of the current welfare system if all tax payers left and only the government and the welfare beneficiaries remained?

It is the difference between enabling people and empowering people.
Empowering others has to start with the individual self having what it takes to step out of preprogrammed choices.

Get out to get strong.

It means breaking out from the shackles of emotional sloth - apathy is the antithesis of effort.
[/quote]

Leaving a bad situation is a valid choice and it certainly changes the chances of being a victim of the statistic posted in the OP that is the topic of the thread.

By taking a risk (yes, there is risk involved) and leaving the environment where you have a high probability of being a victim drastically changes (hopefully for the better depending on where you go) your chances of being a victim.

Does it change that community for the better? Don’t know, but it’s one (or more) fewer candidate(s) of being part of that statistic.

79

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

Does it change that community for the better? Don’t know, but it’s one (or more) fewer candidate(s) of being part of that statistic.[/quote]

I think it does because if, for you personally, the choices were:

  1. Leave and change your self
  2. Stay and join the communal apathy

It does help the community not to have another member of apathy.

By staying and becoming apathetic to survive a bad situation you become part of the problem instead of the solution.

I have left several work environments because it was draining my resolve to stand up for what is right and I found myself joining the helplessness that leads to a state of apathy.

That was like a psychological death so I moved on while my self-preservation instincts were still alive.

80

My only question would be why you think they are capable.

Even when funds are allocated to support the producers of these bastard spawn, we still don’t see any results.