House at 21?

Off Topic
41

[quote]pachell wrote:

My point was there’s little difference between the $30k/year call center employee and the $300k/year physician – the latter may have nicer toys and can sustain a loss of income for a longer duration (or not), fundamentally both are working for living. Same illusion, different game.[/quote]

…and my point is you are living a fantasy if you think there is no difference between someone making 30K a year and what they can afford to take chances with…and some guy who is pulling in 300K a year and can afford to put much of that into savings if they simply live off of 200K a year.

My parents were teachers. I remember them worrying about light bills. The guy making 300K a year isn’t worried about his damned light bills unless it costs a few thousand to run his 3 story 2 acre house.

42

[quote]Professor X wrote:
pachell wrote:

My point was there’s little difference between the $30k/year call center employee and the $300k/year physician – the latter may have nicer toys and can sustain a loss of income for a longer duration (or not), fundamentally both are working for living. Same illusion, different game.

…and my point is you are living a fantasy if you think there is no difference between someone making 30K a year and what they can afford to take chances with…and some guy who is pulling in 300K a year and can afford to put much of that into savings if they simply live off of 200K a year.

My parents were teachers. I remember them worrying about light bills. The guy making 300K a year isn’t worried about his damned light bills unless it costs a few thousand to run his 3 story 2 acre house.[/quote]

Well, $300k/year isn’t much, half is lost to the tax man leaving around $12k/month to play with.

Even a modest $750k/house is going to take half your income, throw in some kids, a wife, some cars, etc. and you have nothing left at the end of the month.

Exactly. How many people in America really live frugally? You think the average guy making that kind of bread is living in a one bedroom apartment?

43

[quote]pachell wrote:

Well, $300k/year isn’t much, half is lost to the tax man leaving around $12k/month to play with.

Even a modest $750k/house is going to take half your income, throw in some kids, a wife, some cars, etc. and you have nothing left at the end of the month.

The guy making 300K a year isn’t worried about his damned light bills unless it costs a few thousand to run his 3 story 2 acre house.

Exactly. How many people in America really live frugally? You think the average guy making that kind of bread is living in a one bedroom apartment?[/quote]

What difference does any of that make? Your claim is that 30K is no different than 300K. That is complete bullshit and you know it. Someone making that kind of money has a hell of a lot more wiggle room when it comes to living beneath their means than someone who can barely afford braces if their kid needs them without insurance covering nearly all of the costs.

If your argument is that you buy more stuff if you make more money, that still doesn’t erase the fact that THEY HAD MORE MONEY TO BUY MORE SHIT.

Most people in America are so in debt that they aren’t even living off of money they actually have at the moment. They buy cars they really can’t afford and buy clothes that are about 2 pay grades above their own so they can impress people around them. Very few are actually making enough to even pay cash for most of their purchases.

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

44

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

[/quote]

Both professionally and physique wise… :stuck_out_tongue:

I have to say tho, the suggestion that $300k gross per annum isn’t a big salary is a pretty hard idea to comprehend, but admittedly I’m not sure what the tax situation in the US is like when comparing net to gross salary, but 50% sounds HUGE.

45

[quote]Hanley wrote:
Professor X wrote:

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

Both professionally and physique wise… :stuck_out_tongue:

I have to say tho, the suggestion that $300k gross per annum isn’t a big salary is a pretty hard idea to comprehend, but admittedly I’m not sure what the tax situation in the US is like when comparing net to gross salary, but 50% sounds HUGE.[/quote]

I don’t have specifics on tax rates, but they take a shit load out of mine. I am paying more money back to the government right now than I paid for college tuition.

46

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Hanley wrote:
Professor X wrote:

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

Both professionally and physique wise… :stuck_out_tongue:

I have to say tho, the suggestion that $300k gross per annum isn’t a big salary is a pretty hard idea to comprehend, but admittedly I’m not sure what the tax situation in the US is like when comparing net to gross salary, but 50% sounds HUGE.

I don’t have specifics on tax rates, but they take a shit load out of mine. I am paying more money back to the government right now than I paid for college tuition.[/quote]

A bit OT perhaps, but where does it go??? In Ireland we pay 20% up to �?�35,400 ($50k) and 41% on everything after that. But we get free education (college/university level like) and an ok free health care system for it. And a yearly gov. pension of something like �?�12k ($17k) after 65 which goes to EVERYONE in the country.

47

[quote]Hanley wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Hanley wrote:
Professor X wrote:

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

Both professionally and physique wise… :stuck_out_tongue:

I have to say tho, the suggestion that $300k gross per annum isn’t a big salary is a pretty hard idea to comprehend, but admittedly I’m not sure what the tax situation in the US is like when comparing net to gross salary, but 50% sounds HUGE.

I don’t have specifics on tax rates, but they take a shit load out of mine. I am paying more money back to the government right now than I paid for college tuition.

A bit OT perhaps, but where does it go??? In Ireland we pay 20% up to �?�35,400 ($50k) and 41% on everything after that. But we get free education (college/university level like) and an ok free health care system for it. And a yearly gov. pension of something like �?�12k ($17k) after 65 which goes to EVERYONE in the country.
[/quote]

Well…we did get a war out of it.

48

[quote]Professor X wrote:
pachell wrote:

Well, $300k/year isn’t much, half is lost to the tax man leaving around $12k/month to play with.

Even a modest $750k/house is going to take half your income, throw in some kids, a wife, some cars, etc. and you have nothing left at the end of the month.

The guy making 300K a year isn’t worried about his damned light bills unless it costs a few thousand to run his 3 story 2 acre house.

Exactly. How many people in America really live frugally? You think the average guy making that kind of bread is living in a one bedroom apartment?

What difference does any of that make? Your claim is that 30K is no different than 300K. That is complete bullshit and you know it. Someone making that kind of money has a hell of a lot more wiggle room when it comes to living beneath their means than someone who can barely afford braces if their kid needs them without insurance covering nearly all of the costs.

If your argument is that you buy more stuff if you make more money, that still doesn’t erase the fact that THEY HAD MORE MONEY TO BUY MORE SHIT.

Most people in America are so in debt that they aren’t even living off of money they actually have at the moment. They buy cars they really can’t afford and buy clothes that are about 2 pay grades above their own so they can impress people around them. Very few are actually making enough to even pay cash for most of their purchases.

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

[/quote]

That’s exactly what I’ve been saying all along. Most people earning high salaries and whatnot are playing the same games, except it’s done with boats, bottle service, cars, etc.

49

[quote]Hanley wrote:
Professor X wrote:

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

Both professionally and physique wise… :stuck_out_tongue:

I have to say tho, the suggestion that $300k gross per annum isn’t a big salary is a pretty hard idea to comprehend, but admittedly I’m not sure what the tax situation in the US is like when comparing net to gross salary, but 50% sounds HUGE.[/quote]

In the higher brackets state, federal, and FICA (Social Security and Medicare) is about 50% of your income. It’s fairly difficult as an employee to have significant deductions, if you own a ton of real estate or a business you can fudge the numbers quite a bit. Being married helps as well.

The average person coughs up around 27% or so.

50

[quote]pachell wrote:
Professor X wrote:
pachell wrote:

Well, $300k/year isn’t much, half is lost to the tax man leaving around $12k/month to play with.

Even a modest $750k/house is going to take half your income, throw in some kids, a wife, some cars, etc. and you have nothing left at the end of the month.

The guy making 300K a year isn’t worried about his damned light bills unless it costs a few thousand to run his 3 story 2 acre house.

Exactly. How many people in America really live frugally? You think the average guy making that kind of bread is living in a one bedroom apartment?

What difference does any of that make? Your claim is that 30K is no different than 300K. That is complete bullshit and you know it. Someone making that kind of money has a hell of a lot more wiggle room when it comes to living beneath their means than someone who can barely afford braces if their kid needs them without insurance covering nearly all of the costs.

If your argument is that you buy more stuff if you make more money, that still doesn’t erase the fact that THEY HAD MORE MONEY TO BUY MORE SHIT.

Most people in America are so in debt that they aren’t even living off of money they actually have at the moment. They buy cars they really can’t afford and buy clothes that are about 2 pay grades above their own so they can impress people around them. Very few are actually making enough to even pay cash for most of their purchases.

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

That’s exactly what I’ve been saying all along. Most people earning high salaries and whatnot are playing the same games, except it’s done with boats, bottle service, cars, etc.[/quote]

If you are writing all of this just to say that American ideals are in the shitter, I think we all knew that already.

Women base their interest in a guy on what brand of clothing he is wearing or how shiny his rims are (obviously the part of the country you live in may lead to a slightly different focus). Guys will live in a broken down piece of shit yet pay 30K+ for a Cadillac just so he can get more ass.

I don’t think anyone is talking about that, however, when discussing the importance of education and the relation to average salary rates.

51

[quote]Professor X wrote:
pachell wrote:
Professor X wrote:
pachell wrote:

Well, $300k/year isn’t much, half is lost to the tax man leaving around $12k/month to play with.

Even a modest $750k/house is going to take half your income, throw in some kids, a wife, some cars, etc. and you have nothing left at the end of the month.

The guy making 300K a year isn’t worried about his damned light bills unless it costs a few thousand to run his 3 story 2 acre house.

Exactly. How many people in America really live frugally? You think the average guy making that kind of bread is living in a one bedroom apartment?

What difference does any of that make? Your claim is that 30K is no different than 300K. That is complete bullshit and you know it. Someone making that kind of money has a hell of a lot more wiggle room when it comes to living beneath their means than someone who can barely afford braces if their kid needs them without insurance covering nearly all of the costs.

If your argument is that you buy more stuff if you make more money, that still doesn’t erase the fact that THEY HAD MORE MONEY TO BUY MORE SHIT.

Most people in America are so in debt that they aren’t even living off of money they actually have at the moment. They buy cars they really can’t afford and buy clothes that are about 2 pay grades above their own so they can impress people around them. Very few are actually making enough to even pay cash for most of their purchases.

Why is anyone here trying to be “average”?

That’s exactly what I’ve been saying all along. Most people earning high salaries and whatnot are playing the same games, except it’s done with boats, bottle service, cars, etc.

If you are writing all of this just to say that American ideals are in the shitter, I think we all knew that already.

Women base their interest in a guy on what brand of clothing he is wearing or how shiny his rims are (obviously the part of the country you live in may lead to a slightly different focus). Guys will live in a broken down piece of shit yet pay 30K+ for a Cadillac just so he can get more ass.

I don’t think anyone is talking about that, however, when discussing the importance of education and the relation to average salary rates.[/quote]

Definitely, I went off on a completely different topic (quality/source of income).

Completely agree with the fact that higher education generally means higher income, but that fact alone doesn’t guarantee long-term financial solvency.

52

OP, do you know why the people couldn’t sell the house in time before? If there’s no good reason then buy the house, at the very least you can rent it out as someone else said.

53

Squiggles, well done on being so proactive. thats why you’re on T-Nation, you’re not one of the sheeple :‘renting is fun for young people’.
I think you’ve made a brave choice (especially considering age), and I hope it comes off for you.
It took me a lot of time and guts to sign for my first house (age 28), and with some luck in the stock market on a speccie company, paid it off 3yrs later (total purchase price 240K AUD). Then after enjoying the freedom from debt for a yr, sucked it up, and signed up for a rental place (440K).

Our market has plateued somewhat, but considering I bought this place in a high growth area, I’m not too concerned mid-term.
It’s just a matter of paying the 1000/month shortfall between rent and interest.

Again, kudos for putting in an offer. If all goes well, your a decade ahead of your peers - you’ll have compound growth working for you.

54

IF you want money, get the house.
IF you want to go back to a kid and have your own world to shape a mold as you see fit, get the house.

IF you want to be explore, don’t get the house.

IF you want to take advantage of the price tag, get the house.

IF you are scared of something bad like a tree falling on the house, don’t get the house. (mind you, with your deal, paying for repairs would still make that deal good)

As for me, I don’t need money. Never the less I would take the deal simply because I don’t believe that traveling is fabulous and adventurous.

I don’t see a point in paying money to fly around looking at other people’s shit when I got my own right here, besides, you have at least 2 weeks vacation per year.

This means you can go to at least 50 countries before you drop dead, that is more than enough exploration and a year spent doing so is simply a waste of good productivity done at home.

I haven’t left my country and I’m 24, but I’ve experience life, owned and lost a small business, helped two street kids get off the streets, a job and an appartment. Saved two street cats, one of which banged my cat and had 8 kittens.

I kept two and gave one of the street cats (rare breed) to my grand mother. I won’t be done my university studies until I am 30-31 and I then have to go back for a masters after 2-3 years work field experience. I will be 35 before I am free of my education, but I am living life all the while doing so, making shit money and I’m cool with that.

55

[quote]

Completely agree with the fact that higher education generally means higher income, but that fact alone doesn’t guarantee long-term financial solvency.[/quote]

It does guarantee almost long term financial solvency if you spend your money properly and know how to invest it or don’t do anything too stupid, like marry and divorce 5-6 times and try to live like Donald Trump.

I’ve been following your arguments with Prof X, Pachell…I don’t know what to say. Either you really have something against us professional guys or you have something to prove.

I’m in the same profession as the Professor and I never really had a problem with finances. I remember going to school yeah, I had a bit of debt but nothing unmanageable once i got into the workforce.

I understand the concept of opportunity costs etc. as you were trying to illustrate. But grads vs. professional grads are two different leagues as well.

Statistically, a guy who graduates with a BA will not match the amount a guy with a DDS or MD will make even working hard those 4 years once the 5th or 6th year kicks (i.e. the first and second year the MD or DDS starts working). Sure you have some dudes with no education making lots of money.

How many people do you see doing that in relation to their “group” i.e. what percentage of ppl with no education actually end up making that much wealth vs. the percentage of people with professional degrees who are struggling to make ends meet compared to the general population in their respective demographic group?

I’m gonna throw in another example just to counter yours. I know a guy who partied and didn’t finish school. Came out and made a million his first year working. What i failed to mention was that his dad is an owner of a large company and hired him as a VP.

Come on Pachell, how many ppl u know like that in relation to the general population (unless of course ur social circle is all wealthy socialites)

NeelyDan I’m from Canada too. When you speak of Grad school student, it depends. That is where the difference of a master’s of PH.D vs. an MD, LLB or DDS comes in. Money. Even though I started 4 years later into the “game” than my peers, i own and make more than them only working 1-2 years even including the debts incurred.

As for the house, Squiggles, as long as you can work it into the budget of yours, I say go for it. You get a fixed asset that is most likely going to appreciate in value (even including inflation) assuming the USA real estate market doesn’t get too bad.

Long term wise you will win out. Always better to throw your money to work towards something that can make you money than to throw it away in rent if you are able to afford it.

56

You can talk all you want about investments, life choices, yadda yadda. Please, please, please, before you buy a house:

  1. Check the prevailing rent in your area.

  2. See how long it’s going to take to break even, assuming that you’d just be putting the “extra” money from renting under your mattress.

  3. See when the break even point is, and whether you’re willing to live in your town that long.

This does two things. It gives you an idea of how much money you’re putting in as “housing cost” compared to “investment”. Second, it gives you one awesome bargaining tool with the seller.

Realtors will try to sell you on emotion, but if you really KNOW why you’re spending money, it’s easier to tell yourself that you’re being “sold”.

57

[quote]cherub_daemon wrote:
You can talk all you want about investments, life choices, yadda yadda. Please, please, please, before you buy a house:

  1. Check the prevailing rent in your area.

  2. See how long it’s going to take to break even, assuming that you’d just be putting the “extra” money from renting under your mattress.

  3. See when the break even point is, and whether you’re willing to live in your town that long.

This does two things. It gives you an idea of how much money you’re putting in as “housing cost” compared to “investment”. Second, it gives you one awesome bargaining tool with the seller.

Realtors will try to sell you on emotion, but if you really KNOW why you’re spending money, it’s easier to tell yourself that you’re being “sold”.[/quote]

Cherub is right. THat is probably the best advice I’ve heard regarding housing in this forum thus far.

58

Just have it carefully inspected and check out the furniture and stuff… My parents bought the house were in now and it turned into a lemon. The cellar has flooded about 8 times… the time before last there was an inch of sewer water coving the floor.

did I mention my room and my brothers room and the laundry room are in the cellar and the pipe broke right over a ton of my stuff stored down stairs…why did it happen? because the people here before us didnt cap a pipe they were suppose to. Its been like hell.

We recently had to seal the whole ceiling of the top floor because the people the builders did a crap job on a seal in the roof before we moved in.

Just cover all your bases carefully.