Looking at the original labs, if I were you, I’d get a glucose tolerance test, and I’d be taking t4 (for potential hypothyroidism) and clomid. Try to make it to 40 before trt.
Your total thyroid numbers are terrible.
@mr.inquisitive Thank you for the insight. Diving into some research now, as I’m not nearly as familiar with thyroid function, and that side of the equation. I do know my mom was diagnosed with hyperthyroidism in her 30s…and from I do know I’d think most of my symptoms lean towards hyper vs hypo?
I know “normal range” doesn’t always carry a lot of weight (ie “normal testosterone”), but aren’t my thyroid numbers somewhat close to what they should be?
No, your totals are a ways away from average. The range is statistical - 2 sigma over each way, meaning 95% inside and 2.5% out at each tail. But there’s a separate distribution for each marker.
For the totals, you’re a ways below average for each. The last study I saw had total t3 average about 115 with most between 100-150, and total t4 (tested more often so more firmly established) average is ~8-8.5 with most 7-9. 5.6, or whatever it is, is very low.
No way you’re hyperthyroid. Hyperthyroid people have total t4 at 14-20+ which is twice the range. And the more you have the faster it metabolizes (a reason the totals DO matter). At lower levels it’s metabolized slower, so having 1/3rd less, you might have 1/2 the thyroid signalling, but that’s a wild ass guess.
The risk vs reward on supplementing thyroid is much better than the risk (or at least hassle) of exogenous T at your age. Now, if you’ve been doing all sorts of t derivatives, running cycles, etc., then who know what’s going on and any disequilibrium could be temporary. But I’d keep this in mind. T4 is cheap and you can come off it if it’s not helping you but I’ve seen a handful of people with numbers very similar to yours feel better taking it.
I personally take 150 mcg/day and always will. My personal goals are total t4 > 8, free t3 3-4, total t3 > 120 and tsh <=1.
You should also test your glucose control. You seem open to experimenting, so, if that’s the case, then look into over the counter insulin sensitizers (lipoic acid and chromium), while you wait on tests. If you ate before your posted test, then ignore is less important but still at least test a1c and fasting insulin if your symptoms never improve.
best of luck.
Goodness, I just saw how long my note was. lol. Sorry about the length. I write for a living (I’m a portfolio manager), so it just flows.
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haven’t been active on here lately- got sick then had a two week trip to Europe, but finally had my first shot this week. Injection was much easier than I expected, had no issues. Also started with only T, skipped the HCG and anastrozole.
Will keep you guys updated with progress. Thanks again for all the help!
First- wanted to post an update- just 10 days in but feeling great. I’m up about 9 pounds (some of that is diet and coming off vacation), waking up in the morning with much more energy, and just looking overall healthier. Workout intensity has really started dialing up the last few days also.
Had a question about some Test my dad got. A friend of his was prescribed TRT and never used this…125mg cypionate, 125mg enthanate, 50mg propionate. At 300mg/mL obviously he’d want to just do 1/2-3/4 mL (he’s prescribed 200mg Cyp). Do you guys think this would be safe to use? Know these are all different esters with different release times/half lives, but wasn’t sure if this would really throw him off? Hes only been on TRT about 6 weeks, I told him he should at least wait til he’s 15-20 week’s stable on his protoco. Any thoughts? Thanks guys!
Also forgot to mention that it expires in December
If it has not been used at all, it’s good for years past its expiration date. The only thing is it might lose a little potency over time, but this vials have additives to prevent bacteria from growing.
Cypionate and Enanthate are virtually identical and interchangeable, not really any point to putting both in there. The prop will hit fast and leave fast, and overall the injection could actually hurt. That is very strong per mL, it might burn or cause PIP issues.
What if he were to do 3/4mL rather than the full dose? I do feel like 300mg in one shot is strong…
It’s the concentration that tends to make it more painful.
But yeah no one here would recommend him doing 300mg at once. It should be split up to 2-3x a week minimum, but even then he might have PIP issues. I guess there’s only one way to find out
It really ought to be more diluted than that.
Ah, I see what you guys are saying. PIP issues?
Post injection pain
Alright guys, I’m about 16 weeks in and thought it was time for an update. Linking the new bloodwork, but here are some highlights. Since starting the test, I’m 20-25lbs. I’m filling my clothes out again, energy is better, overall happiness, motivation, strength way up, etc. Improvements sexually but not quite where I expected, will touch more on that later.
Before TRT:
Test: 767
Free Test: 10.9
Estradiol: 18.2
SHBG: 95.7!
About 14 weeks into TRT:
Test: 1680
Free Test: 357.8 (pg/mL)
Estradiol: 27
SHBG: 40 More than cut in half!
My initial prescription was 200mg test c 1x week, hcg 2x week, anastrozole 1mg 2x week. I’ve tweaked this as I’ve gone, and found that 1 test shot per week on Saturday did make me feel better than 2 (Saturday, Wednesday). Anastrazole at 2mg was way too much…I moved to .5mg MWF, with HCG shots on Tuesday and Wednesday.
Onto the HCG- I’ve skipped weeks here and there for travel, and my doctor left it out of my last supply on accident. I know many of you have voiced this as well, but I actually feel better without hcg. The hcg seems to make me swell and hold water, and I get slight anxiety on injection days. Do you think it’s necessary to stay on it? Will my boys completely shrink/become inactive without it? I’m 29 and want kids someday, but right now am single and kids aren’t on the radar. Will it be difficult to start the hcg later and try to re-establish that signal?
Final item: 1-2 days before I got this bloodwork I started my anavar at 12.5mg/day. As I mentioned, I was feeling much better sexually, but still not waking up with morning wood, and still didn’t feel full benefit from the test like I thought. Erection quality improved, but leveled off and wasn’t at the level you’d expect. I experimented with the Anavar for a week before starting TRT and noticed immediate benefits, morning wood, harder erections, etc, so I thought it was worth a shot on TRT. The effects were definitely noticeable- and even stronger with the higher overall test from TRT. I stopped a couple days ago for a few reasons. I started shedding much more hair (although my hair has remained really thick, and I used to shed all the time growing up/through high school & college). More important than the hair, I had a bit of anxiety on the var as well and a hard time focusing. Mind seems to wander and I feel like I’m in fog. Finally, I just wasn’t sure how safe it would be long term, so didn’t want to start getting used to that feeling. It was the best I’ve felt sexually since early college, but didn’t want to get carried away with something unsustainable. I still have about 10-15 weeks left depending on how many mg I’d want to do (thought about dialing it back to 6.25mg). Any thoughts on the var at a constant, ultra low dose? I’ve heard Dr. Rand McClain uses 2.5-5mg/day full time for his patients with SHBG issues.
This was a lot- will get better about more consistent updates so I don’t have to post a novel every time. As always, really appreciate any feedback or insight you guys may have!
One more note on the anavar. Starting it is what made me think to go get bloodwork (to get a baseline before i got too deep). Do you think 1-2 days of anavar before that bloodwork could’ve impacted my SHBG immediately? Wondering if maybe I’m sitting a little higher normally, without Var (60-65?) and that’s why I’m not feeling as well as I could sexually?
Update: things have really
Taken a turn the last few weeks. Out of the blue, I’ve had intense waves of anxiety hitting. Have never really been an anxious person, but the intensity is to the point that it’s affecting me at work and in day to day life. I’m assuming this is TRT related, as there have been other changes chemically. I did start a new job recently, but again have always been a pretty stress free guy. Could me T be too high? E doesn’t look too out of whack, right? Any insight greatly appreciated @traveling-man @systemlord @enackers
You’re levels are very high and you have plenty of room to lower your dosage. You must have used a different lab company this last time, the Free T ranges are different. I wish the ranges were the same so we could more easily compare.
Your estrogen isn’t even consider moderately elevated, it’s fine. One thing is for sure, you don’t aromatase much at all. There have been on rare occasion where men are just overly sensitive to estrogen, but is so uncommon.
Does this intense wave of anxiety occur within say 48 hour of your injections? If so it might be the hormonal peaks themselves causing all the problems and not the high levels.
I would say the waves are definitely most intense around 36-48 hours after injection. I’ve gone back to 2x week at 100mg, and may dial that back to 75mg 2x week. I’ve also been off and on with hcg as I travel frequently for work. The last month has been my most consistent month on it, and anxiety has been present at least at a low level basically the entire month. Almost a feeling of numbness and lack of being present if that makes sense? Going to try dropping that completely as well.
Could this maybe just be my adrenals getting used to over twice the levels of test? Should I try going to EOD subq injections? The anxiety is intense enough to make me consider dropping TRT altogether, but feel like that’s going to really put me in a bad place
Your e2 is that low without an AI?