Gunning for Mormons

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
21

[quote]Bigd1970 wrote:
Do you have a point at all, or did you just want to start an Anti-Mormon Thread and see where it goes?

I guess if your point was to point out that the two groups one practicing polygamy, which is not legal or an accepted practice in western culture, and the other practicing gay marriage, which at this point is not legal, and accepted practice in western culture were both practicing something that is not legal and is not accepted in western culture, than I guess your point was made.

Other than that I fail to see the correlation between the two groups.
[/quote]

So, if I read you right, you see no irony in Mormon’s providing 70% of the funding to pass an amendment to the CA Constitution that says:

“Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California.”

22

[quote]jawara wrote:
Even if you are married to multiple women you are still married and they are women. [/quote]

The point is that mormons didn’t practice “traditional marriage” and were persecuted for it, to the point that they would have gone to war with the U.S. government unless they stopped practicing polygamy. They continue to believe in polygamy to this day, although it is now restricted to marrying multiple women in the afterlife.

How is that “traditional marriage” by any definition?

Yet after all that, they have the hypocrisy to fight gay marriage on the grounds of it not being “traditional marriage”.

23

Why single out Mormons? Didn’t they throw a hell of a lot of cash from Utah to CA? 1 in every 4 ad dollars is the figure I’ve heard quoted.

24

Because it is particularly hypocritical for mormons to campaign against gays on the basis of “traditional marriage” given their own religious history and current beliefs.

25

[quote]forlife wrote:
jawara wrote:
Even if you are married to multiple women you are still married and they are women.

The point is that mormons didn’t practice “traditional marriage” and were persecuted for it, to the point that they would have gone to war with the U.S. government unless they stopped practicing polygamy. They continue to believe in polygamy to this day, although it is now restricted to marrying multiple women in the afterlife.

How is that “traditional marriage” by any definition?

Yet after all that, they have the hypocrisy to fight gay marriage on the grounds of it not being “traditional marriage”.[/quote]

I don’t think 53% of California’s voters are Mormon. I guess you need a scapegoat for your defeat and the mormons are an obvious whipping boy.

26

[quote]Gambit_Lost wrote:
Why single out Mormons? Didn’t they throw a hell of a lot of cash from Utah to CA? 1 in every 4 ad dollars is the figure I’ve heard quoted. [/quote]

And your left-wing compatriots never bring in out-of-state money to help fight their battles?

Try not to hit the hypocrisy button so often.

27

[quote]rainjack wrote:
I don’t think 53% of California’s voters are Mormon. I guess you need a scapegoat for your defeat and the mormons are an obvious whipping boy. [/quote]

Mormons provided more funding for Proposition 8 than any other group. Even if they didn’t, their crusade in the name of “traditional marriage” is hypocrisy and you know it.

28

Some interesting background on the push for money and precisely scripted canvassing at the end.

29

Barack Obama was really, really good at getting out the black vote. The black vote is also socially conservative on issues like gay marriage and largely voted against gay marriage. Ironically, liberals killed Prop 8.

One minority group (African-Americans) takes a shit on another (gays and lesbians) who blame it on another (Mormons.) Isn’t it great?

30

[quote]jawara wrote:
Bigd1970 wrote:
Do you have a point at all, or did you just want to start an Anti-Mormon Thread and see where it goes?

I guess if your point was to point out that the two groups one practicing polygamy, which is not legal or an accepted practice in western culture, and the other practicing gay marriage, which at this point is not legal, and accepted practice in western culture were both practicing something that is not legal and is not accepted in western culture, than I guess your point was made.

Other than that I fail to see the correlation between the two groups.

Ask yourself this, if Mormons are the evil group that they are being portrayed as, than why when Gay Marriage was instituted against the will of 61 percent of the vote in California, why did you not see the Mormons out burning police cars and rioting in the streets?

Why if Mormons are so evil, did you not hear about the Mormons running around beating up the No on 8 Groups? Because it did not happen.

Of course now it is ok for the No on 8 Group to single out and attack those who voted yes on 8. Why single out the Mormons? Did not 70 percent of African Americans vote yes on 8? Ok, lets attack them. Probably because there is no way to attack the African American population who know what it is like to be hated because of the color of your skin.

Maybe because they REALLY had their civil rights denied to them. Maybe because a Minority group can’t wake up in the morning and decide they don’t want to be who they are today. This is not about civil rights. Can anyone show me where in the Constitution it gives any group the Civil Right to Marriage? Anyone?

Because Marriage is not a Civil Right. Marriage is not a right given to us by the Government. Marraige is a Religious Ceremony that the Government agreed to recognize as a means to collect tax revenue, and make it easier to account for family groups. It is not a right granted to anyone by the government.

I’m wondering if you comment was directed at me. If it was I think I need to give you my stance on this topic. While I don’t agree with the Mormon church on a few topics I think they have the right to believe what they want and they shouldnt have to change their stance to fit someone else’s agenda. I think that if the gay/lesbian crowd wants to have church that honor the marriages they need to make their own churches, not make other churches change their belief system to fit them. I think the Satanic church would marry themwouldnt they? Yesterday I actually called the Mormon temple in Tenn and said that if they need any help or support because of this they can shoot me an email and I’ll be on my way to help.
I guess I should have titled this thread “They’re gunning for the Mormons”.[/quote]

What is the utter failure of yours to comprehend reality? Plenty of arguments for why the government should or should not recognize same-sex relationships and provide according legal benefits.

But NO one, not the most ardent supporter of gay marriage, is trying to force churches or any other religious institution to recognize these unions as marriages. The only issue with the Mormon church at all was telling them to shut the fuck up and mind their business and stop actively campaigning for the GOVERNMENT to not recognize these relationships. None of them give a shit what the Mormon church’s private stance is or if they ever recognize gay unions as legitimate.

31

Second order effects, this endears Mormons to the conservative right possibly increasing support for a Romney presidential bid in 2012.

33

That is a super point. The mental abuse that the women go through absolutely sickens me.

34

Wow, a lot of comments on here.

Meesuspush, glad too see you are upholding the Mormon tradition of being some of the freakiest women around.

I have to say you have brought up a good point though as far as abuse and Domestic Violence go. It is a shame that not only affects the LDS Church, but society as a whole. The LDS Church has not cornered the market on this tragic topic. You make your statement as if abuse of any sort is tolerated within the LDS Church. Let me assure you, it is not. The LDS Church does not condone abuse of any sort, mental or physical. Thank you for your concern though, and the opportunity to clear up this common misconception.

As far as the Mormon Church just shutting up, or shutting the Fu… Up as it was so eloquently put earlier, isn’t it a shame when we as Americans can not exercise our right to speak our minds. We as a society have truly come a long way when we condone the break down of law and order. This is not just about Gay Marriage, though it is a major topic. This is also about activist Judges. When does it become the right of Judges to override the will of the people? When 61 percent of Californians voted in favor of the statement that Marriage is between a man and a woman. The 4 activist Judges stepped in and overturned the decision, as being unconstitutional. Californians then did what is our constitutional right and modified the constitution. Now, the Judges are trying to figure out a way to undo the will of the people. 53 percent of the the people decided that there will be no gay marriage, may I take the opportunity to say California only joined 40 other states in banning Gay Marriage. 40 of the 50 States have spoken and have all joined to say no to gay marriage. Three of those were in the last election. Florida, Arizona, and California all joined together and said no to gay marriage, this should tell the gay activist something. The people do not condone gay marriage.

35

[quote]pushharder wrote:
DoubleDuce wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
DoubleDuce wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
DoubleDuce wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
Anyone else notice the irony in Mormons supporting marriage = 1 man + one woman?

Polygamy what outlawed in the Mormon church decades ago.

Kicking and screaming the church abandoned the practice.

Did you check the date? 1878?

When it comes to religious practices, 130 years is not that long. The point was that the church didn’t give it up on its own accord. It was forced. Still there are adherents:

Yeah and oddly enough around that same time, Many Christians were forced to give up owning slaves. So, anyone today who is a Christian is just at heart a racist would be slave owner.

Polygamy and the modern LDS Church are entirely unrelated. Even when they practiced it they taught it was only appropriate for certain people at certain times and never blanket-ly approved it for every member.

With all due respect, you don’t know what you’re talking about. My wife was raised Mormon and was taught in high school seminary classes that polygamy would return some day.

[/quote]
Then my Mormon friends are liars. Unless you are talking about the sect that broke away in order to continue practicing polygamy (they no longer call themselves Mormons). Though they admit that if polygamy were okay at one point in time it might be possible for it to happen again, though you could make the same argument for Christians.

Polygamy exists throughout the Old testament, and I don’t ever recall reading about it in a negative context, much the same way it exists in the Book of Mormon.

38

[quote]Bigd1970 wrote:
When does it become the right of Judges to override the will of the people?
[/quote]

When the will of the majority is unconstitutional. Then of course, the constitution must then be amended. Which California voters appear to do quite frequently. The California constitution is now 110 pages long.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/const-toc.html

I think the residents of California see their constitution as serving a different purpose than enumerate individual rights and limit the scope of government.

39

Yes, but when the people amend the constitution, then it takes it out of the hands of the Judges and it now becomes the will of the people. That is why the Constitution was written to protect the people from Judges who attempt to override the will of the people. Which happens quite often in California as well.

I agree with you that the Judges have the right to thier opinion when the Laws are unconstitutional, however when the people vote and speak, by amending the constitution it is no longer a case for the Judges.

40

[quote]Badunk wrote:
Why should ANY church be tax exempt? They are, in the main, cash-rich BUSINESSES.

Total scam, if you ask me.[/quote]

it is a non-profit business, that is why?