[quote]The Mage wrote:
orion wrote:
You obviously do not get my point.
I was asking where this feeling of US moral superiority comes from when the US is killing more civilians than terrorists ever could.
The answer is apparently that the US do not want to kill those people, it just happens as a matter of consequence.
That would be a form of dolus eventualis though, which borders so close to intent that it is sometimes indistinguishable from it.
Is that a serious way to see things that you can kill as many people as you like as an unintended consequence but not one if you really mean it?
When does this logic become absurd?
At a ratio of 10:1? 100:1? 10000:1?
Your answer is that you bring more reasons to the table why the war in Iraq is justified while I question that there is a significant difference between the US moral outlook and that of Bin Laden.
Both see people as disposable pawns.
Giving me more reasons WHY you think it is necessary to use them as disposable pawns has really nothing to do with the questions I have yet to get an answer too.
I understand exactly what you are saying and why, and it does not matter what I say, you will not accept it.
Just like you ignore the mass graves in Iraq.
What gave us the moral superiority to to attack Hitler? Was it only because he said publicly that he declared war with us? Saddam had declared war with us repeatedly, but we ignored him for years.
Be honest, this has nothing to do with anything America has done. This is about your belief in your belief in your moral superiority over America. That no matter what we do it is wrong.
If you have a problem differentiating between a terrorist and an American soldier, then you are nothing but a blind idiot. I am not saying this to attack you, but to point out what is going on in your head.
I can understand people being against the war. But I am still waiting for one intelligent argument on the subject. Comparing the soldiers to terrorists is not an intelligent argument, and never will be. My opinion can in fact be changed if somebody can intelligently give me a reason.
I’ll be nice and explain, as has probably been done millions of times before. America attempts to minimize civilian causalities. In fact one of the reasons the Iraq post war battles are still going on is because of that attempt to minimize civilian casualties. Terrorists specifically focused on attacking the civilians.
But this does not matter to you, which is why you use terms like moral superiority in an attempt to attack us verbally.
What I think is happening with you is everybody you know in the real world, no on line, all believe the same thing, and you are following along because that is what is familiar to you. Ask yourself what would happen if you walked into the middle of a group of your close friends and said you now supported Bush and America?
Even as a test you would not do it, not because it isn’t what you believe, but how you would feel not agreeing with your friends.
Back to the deaths in Iraq, I am unhappy about every single one of them. I regret their deaths, including the brainwashed masses convinced they will get their virgins for committing suicide even when the Koran specifically forbids it.
I also regret the women who were raped by Saddam’s “professional rapists” as one of their forms of torture. I regret the people Saddam gassed.
I am also saddened by the one child that dies from an inoculation when that same inoculation saved thousands of other children.
I realize you want peace. I want it too. But I am no fool, and know history.
Do you know of when the Vikings were becoming the feared group they were, on country decided to ask them not to leave if they simply paid them off.
Guess what, it worked…for the first group. The told their Viking friends about the easy haul, and the following year every freaken Viking in the world descended on that little country.
Arthur Neville Chamberlain forgot this little piece of history, and is famous for attempting to appease Hitler similar to appeasing the Vikings.
And now you do the same.
You also ask us to walk away from a people who currently still need us. To turn our backs on them. To just let them rot. How many will die then? If they are not stable before we leave, imagine how many would die then? Is not the idea of leaving worse then staying? Does that not make you more like the terrorists, especially since your position specifically supports them?
You keep repeating the moral superiority line and have yet to look in the mirror to see your moral hypocrisy. [/quote]
This has nothing to do with appeasing, because the Iraq did not pose a serious threat to the US.
Saddam Hussein even offered to leave.
If you think it is about “appeasing” Muslim terrorists, well they do not have a country and if they die a sudden and surprisng death in the middle of nowhere, that would be most unfortunate, wouldn´t it?
We both know the US has specialists for such occasions.
There is still leading no plausible road to the invasion of Iraq.
Then, if I piss my friends off, it is because I am very much pro capitalist, anti welfare and very often pro American.
I have no problems with annoying people. Most of them would not react so strongly if they did not know that I have a point.
My issue with the "moral superiority " is not so much with Bush or his administrations because they are accomplished bullshitters who do not believe a word they say, it is with the American public, especially members of this board.
Exhibit A:
I wrote:
He responded:
So, are you really trying to tell me that there is no hypocrisy involved or how would you feel if someone invaded your country, killed 10 million, displaced 40 million and destroyed all civil infrastructure to make you live his way of live?
