Georgia’s 9th district?!?!? What a surprise that this would come from the great state of Georgia!
Indeed, as Georgia is home to the “Cutest Little Communist in Congress,” Cynthia McKinney: http://www.classicdykes.com/cynthia_mckinney.htm
shame on McKinney for trying to help Katrina victims…
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
Indeed, as Georgia is home to the “Cutest Little Communist in Congress,” Cynthia McKinney: http://www.classicdykes.com/cynthia_mckinney.htm[/quote]
She’s not in Congress anymore. Georgians voted her out.
Well, she earned that title while she was still in Congress, obviously, and is still well-known by that phrase. And Georgia is still home to her, so far as I know.
[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:
[quote]Sifu wrote:
Yeah but, a lot of those coutries consider national socialism right wing too. [/quote]
National socialism is right wing.
[/quote]
Please don’t further confuse the guys here with anything factual.
Now back to the topic: about how Obama was born in Kenya, ROTFL…
I hope you guys keep working the kook and conspiracy angles, it’s very entertaining.
[quote]K2000 wrote:
[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:
[quote]Sifu wrote:
Yeah but, a lot of those coutries consider national socialism right wing too. [/quote]
National socialism is right wing.
[/quote]
Please don’t further confuse the guys here with anything factual.
Now back to the topic: about how Obama was born in Kenya, ROTFL…
I hope you guys keep working the kook and conspiracy angles, it’s very entertaining.[/quote]
“National Socialism is right wing” is a “fact”?
Please elaborate.
[quote][b]FAQ
- Why is Hitler slightly right ? The Nazis were socialists, so they weren’t fascists either.[/b]
Let’s start with the second part first. Some respondents confuse Nazism, a political party platform, with fascism, which is a particular structure of government. Fascism legally sanctions the persecution of a particular group within the country - political, ethnic, religious - whatever. So within Nazism there are elements of fascism, as well as militarism, capitalism, socialism etc. To tar all socialists with the national socialist brush is as absurd as citing Bill Gates and Augusto Pinochet in the same breath as examples of free market capitalism.
Economically, Hitler was well to the right of Stalin. Post-war investigations led to a number of revelations about the cosy relationship between German corporations and the Reich. No such scandals subsequently surfaced in Russia, because Stalin had totally squashed the private sector. By contrast, once in power, the Nazis achieved rearmament through deficit spending. One of our respondents has correctly pointed out that they actively discouraged demand increases because they wanted infrastructure investment. Under the Reich, corporations were largely left to govern themselves, with the incentive that if they kept prices under control, they would be rewarded with government contracts. Hardly a socialist economic agenda !
But Nazi corporate ties extended well beyond Germany. It is an extraordinarily little known fact that in 1933 a cabal of Wall Street financiers and industrialists plotted an armed coup against President Roosevelt and the US Constitutional form of government. The coup planners - all of them deeply hostile to socialism - were enthusiastic supporters of German national socialism and Italian fascism. Details of the little publicised Congressional report on the failed coup may be read in 1000 Americans:The Real Rulers of the USA by George Seldes.
Fascism, according to the American Heritage Dictionary (1983) is A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism. Italian philosopher Giovanni Gentile’s entry in the Encyclopedia Italiana read: Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power. No less an authority on fascism than Mussolini was so pleased with that definition that he later claimed credit for it.
Nevertheless, within certain US circles,the misconception remains that fascism is essentially left wing, and that the Nazis were socialists simply because of the “socialism” in their name. We wonder if respondents who insist on uncritically accepting the Nazis’ cynical self-definition would be quite as eager to believe that the German Democratic Republic was democratic.[/quote]
[quote]K2000 wrote:
[quote][b]FAQ
- Why is Hitler slightly right ? The Nazis were socialists, so they weren’t fascists either.[/b]
Let’s start with the second part first. Some respondents confuse Nazism, a political party platform, with fascism, which is a particular structure of government. Fascism legally sanctions the persecution of a particular group within the country - political, ethnic, religious - whatever. So within Nazism there are elements of fascism, as well as militarism, capitalism, socialism etc. To tar all socialists with the national socialist brush is as absurd as citing Bill Gates and Augusto Pinochet in the same breath as examples of free market capitalism.
Economically, Hitler was well to the right of Stalin. Post-war investigations led to a number of revelations about the cosy relationship between German corporations and the Reich. No such scandals subsequently surfaced in Russia, because Stalin had totally squashed the private sector. By contrast, once in power, the Nazis achieved rearmament through deficit spending. One of our respondents has correctly pointed out that they actively discouraged demand increases because they wanted infrastructure investment. Under the Reich, corporations were largely left to govern themselves, with the incentive that if they kept prices under control, they would be rewarded with government contracts. Hardly a socialist economic agenda !
But Nazi corporate ties extended well beyond Germany. It is an extraordinarily little known fact that in 1933 a cabal of Wall Street financiers and industrialists plotted an armed coup against President Roosevelt and the US Constitutional form of government. The coup planners - all of them deeply hostile to socialism - were enthusiastic supporters of German national socialism and Italian fascism. Details of the little publicised Congressional report on the failed coup may be read in 1000 Americans:The Real Rulers of the USA by George Seldes.
Fascism, according to the American Heritage Dictionary (1983) is A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism. Italian philosopher Giovanni Gentile’s entry in the Encyclopedia Italiana read: Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power. No less an authority on fascism than Mussolini was so pleased with that definition that he later claimed credit for it.
Nevertheless, within certain US circles,the misconception remains that fascism is essentially left wing, and that the Nazis were socialists simply because of the “socialism” in their name. We wonder if respondents who insist on uncritically accepting the Nazis’ cynical self-definition would be quite as eager to believe that the German Democratic Republic was democratic.[/quote]
http://www.politicalcompass.org/faq#faq19[/quote]
That does not adress the Nazis being “right wing”.
It adresses that just because Nazis were also socialists not all socialists are Nazis.
Nobody claimed that in this thread.
The fact that sowjet socialism was even more left wing does not make the “right wing” either.
I think that it is safe to say that the German National SOcialist Workers Party who engaged in quite a bit of economic planning and social engineering and was repeatedly reiterating that it was a socialist party was in fact a socialist party.
Which, if the term “left wing” is supposed to have any meaning makes them a totalitarian left wing party.
Also, the original fascists were a Marxist split group, FDR, a liberal, modelled his government after Mussolinis Italy, a fascist state, and social democracy, i.e., liberalism was founded to bring about socialism through democratic means.
They all share very basic beliefs, like statism, social engineering and the belief in government control of the economy.
So how is it that the Nazis were “right wing” again?
[quote]orion wrote:
So how is it that the Nazis were “right wing” again?
[/quote]
How is it that the Nazis were “left wing” again? Just because they had the name “Socialist” in the party name? Because that’s blatantly stupid, as addressed above. The German Democratic Republic was not democratic. Just labeling something does not make it so.
Do you know who was the main opposition party to the National Socialist Party in Germany?
Were they also Socialists as well?
If so, then you contend that both major factions in prewar Germany were socialists? Because that would be pretty stupid.
Repeated for emphasis.
Well, if you hate those “wing-nuts,” then it is very appealing to insist that the Nazis were right-wing.
It’s not as if any of them are alive to say otherwise, and besides they spoke German anyway, may not have characterized themselves under a left-right system, and if they did, their criteria for that system may not have been the same as is common today. So it can safely be asserted, as those who argue against it with reason can just be ignored.
Way to stay on topic guys.
Obama’s eligibility is, in terms of practical reality, a serious topic?
Orion asked me to back up my statement that the Nazis were Right wing.
So I linked to PoliticalCompass.org, a website that specializes in placing people on a political spectrum. According to PoliticalCompass,org, the Nazis were “slightly Right”.
I don’t understand why this isn’t sufficient, and put an end to this once and for all. Orion’s counter argument was kind of vague IMO, and I can’t say that I understood, except that he didn’t like their line of thinking, or they were discussing tangental aspects. I’m not sure.
Funny, Orion took their survey himself and seemed to think the results were accurate, as did every other guy here who participated (I didn’t hear anyone complaining that their results were off). If you believe PoliticalCompass can place you correctly on the political spectrum, it’s fair to assume that they can correctly place the National Socialists on the political spectrum, too.
And no, Obama’s political eligibility is not a serious topic IMO. But go nuts…
[quote]K2000 wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
So how is it that the Nazis were “right wing” again?
[/quote]
How is it that the Nazis were “left wing” again? Just because they had the name “Socialist” in the party name? Because that’s blatantly stupid, as addressed above. The German Democratic Republic was not democratic. Just labeling something does not make it so.
Do you know who was the main opposition party to the National Socialist Party in Germany?
Were they also Socialists as well?
If so, then you contend that both major factions in prewar Germany were socialists? Because that would be pretty stupid.[/quote]
Really?
Are Catholics and Protestants not Christian?
Are Shiites and Sunnis not Muslim?
And yet they killed and kill each other like theres no tomorrow.
Religious schisms are never pretty.
[quote]K2000 wrote:
Repeated for emphasis.[/quote]
Yeah well, there is no misconception.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
Well, if you hate those “wing-nuts,” then it is very appealing to insist that the Nazis were right-wing.
It’s not as if any of them are alive to say otherwise, and besides they spoke German anyway, may not have characterized themselves under a left-right system, and if they did, their criteria for that system may not have been the same as is common today. So it can safely be asserted, as those who argue against it with reason can just be ignored.[/quote]
Well, if only someone who actually spoke German posted the original quotes of the Nazis themselves with accurate translations…
Just kidding, that does not work.
[quote]K2000 wrote:
Orion asked me to back up my statement that the Nazis were Right wing.
So I linked to PoliticalCompass.org, a website that specializes in placing people on a political spectrum. According to PoliticalCompass,org, the Nazis were “slightly Right”.
I don’t understand why this isn’t sufficient, and put an end to this once and for all. Orion’s counter argument was kind of vague IMO, and I can’t say that I understood, except that he didn’t like their line of thinking, or they were discussing tangental aspects. I’m not sure.
Funny, Orion took their survey himself and seemed to think the results were accurate, as did every other guy here who participated (I didn’t hear anyone complaining that their results were off). If you believe PoliticalCompass can place you correctly on the political spectrum, it’s fair to assume that they can correctly place the National Socialists on the political spectrum, too.
And no, Obama’s political eligibility is not a serious topic IMO. But go nuts…[/quote]
Well I guess that site knows better than Goering then:
You might also want to look up Sombart and German “Kathedersozialismus”.