Ebola

Back on July 28 I posted that, should the epidemic reach Lagos, we would be doomed, and we would be seeing quarantines of flights.

If only.

I was wrong in this case: in Lagos, those who defied quarantine were shot, and that is what it may take to control the outbreak in populated centers. And instead of Amsterdam and Rome, we are seeing the first swallows of sorrow in Dallas and Madrid.

We re now 6 weeks behind this epidemic. The problems are:

  1. Institutional arrogance.
    The CDC has very smart folks. Smart folks are exactly the wrong people to manage this problem; they actually believe that they know things. (Witness the incredible naivete of Fauci, and various spokesman, and their righteous assertions that the virus can only be spread by the symptomatic, or that a person must have fever to be infectious, nonsense about animal vectors, etc. None of these assertions were based on science or fact or observations from prior epidemics.) What they do not know will kill us.

  2. Bayes theorem.
    Screening at airports is ridiculous, not just because we cannot train everyone in time–we are 6 weeks late. Fever monitoring will have a high false-negative rate.
    And we are starting the influenza season. The airport personnel–if they are to competent at all–are going to have far more false positives (flu cases relative to ebola cases), and this will overwhelm the screening system.

  3. The incompetence of the well-meaning.
    Tyvek suits? Non-latex gloves? Ask Baxter why there is a shortage of IV fluids. In a massive epidemic, these will be unavailable, leaky, and as we have now seen, used badly, infecting health care workers. What health care worker is now going to be willing to take care of salvageable patients–or suspected patients?
    Our track record is clear: just look at the sterling success most hospitals haven controlling c. difficile enterocolitis.

There should be an absolute quarantine on flights out of West Africa. A few health care workers can return under quarantine. Sorry, people will die in West Africa regardless. For those who argue that this is heartless, I point out that every Ebola epidemic has ended, not mby human intervention, but because it has “burned-out,” i.e., it has exhausted the host population.
For those that argue that people will find a way to migrate into our borders from third countries, I point out that if one believes that the incubation is as long as 3 weeks (and I do not) then the lengthened travel time will perforce serve to sort out the sick from the salvageable.

Anecdote:
My brother recalls a time when he served in a large port city as a medical resident. The ER had a special room for screening travelers from abroad. If there was fever and a palmar vesicular rash, the intern was obliged to push a large red button, and an iron door would descend, locking as prisoners both patient and doctor in the room for a week. One took care of the other through the course of smallpox.
Imagine a world where such a room was not just imagined, but executed, and expected to be used.
This is the attitude we should have about Ebola in this century. But we have the gall to presume that scientists have the knowledge, and that others–doctors and nurses–will sacrifice themselves, rather than demanding that the necessary extremes be taken.

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
It’s not racism. It’s the Republicans, silly.

Republicans are pro-Ebola.
The CDC is too small to stop the virus, but still funds Jazzercise

"…Frantic to hold the Senate, Democrats are now claiming Republicans are pro-Ebola?really. Anything is better than having to defend White House competence or even the adequacy of the public-health response, though this election debate would benefit from a fact or two.

Here?s a heavy-rotation TV spot from Arkansas incumbent Mark Pryor against his GOP opponent: ‘Tom Cotton voted against preparing America for pandemics like Ebola. Congressman Cotton voted to cut billions from our nation?s medical disaster and emergency programs. . . . Instead, Cotton voted for tax cuts for billionaires funding his campaign, rather than protecting our families.’ "[/quote]

but if the outbreak continues well into 2015, it will play heavily in the republican immigration reform position

Update-

We now have two nurses who cared for the Liberian man in Dallas diagnosed with the disease. One of them had flown on a commercial airline the day prior to being diagnosed.

One of the issues with providing hospital care involves waste disposal. Geez. At Emory they actually had to disinfect any human waste with bleach before releasing it into the sewer system. I hadn’t even thought of that. They had some of the contractors who deal with hospital linens and such refuse to handle it. Each case is incredibly expensive. CDC is now dispatching special teams to U.S. hospitals with a confirmed case. Obviously the folks in Dallas weren’t prepared.

In other Ebola news, the WHO estimates as many as 10,000 new cases per week by early December.

One of the reasons they can’t get ahead of it in Africa is just low level corruption. The bribing of body disposal teams is widespread in effected areas, and dying of Ebola has a stigma so people tend to try to hide it. For $40 or $50 in bribes, families can often go ahead keep the body for the wake. Washing, then hugging and kissing the remains is common, as is a private burial nearby.

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

Obama wants to close Gitmo. Maybe we need to remodel it, or somewhere similar into a quarantine facility for health care workers and other Americans coming back from Africa? So far I believe we just have the CDC setting up some cursory screening of incoming flights at only 5 major airports. Taking people’s temperatures and such. After they’ve already hopped through London or elsewhere.

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
After they’ve already hopped through London or elsewhere.
[/quote]

I don’t think that UK has any direct flights to the affected countries (apart from US and Spain). Paris and Amsterdam are I think the relevant hubs.

I wonder how long before we realise that sending healthworkers to affected regions and thus ruining any pretence at quarantine is stupid? None have come back with it yet, to our knowledge, but it is only a matter of time…

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
Update-

We now have two nurses who cared for the Liberian man in Dallas diagnosed with the disease. One of them had flown on a commercial airline the day prior to being diagnosed.

One of the issues with providing hospital care involves waste disposal. Geez. At Emory they actually had to disinfect any human waste with bleach before releasing it into the sewer system. I hadn’t even thought of that. They had some of the contractors who deal with hospital linens and such refuse to handle it. Each case is incredibly expensive. CDC is now dispatching special teams to U.S. hospitals with a confirmed case. Obviously the folks in Dallas weren’t prepared.

In other Ebola news, the WHO estimates as many as 10,000 new cases per week by early December.

One of the reasons they can’t get ahead of it in Africa is just low level corruption. The bribing of body disposal teams is widespread in effected areas, and dying of Ebola has a stigma so people tend to try to hide it. For $40 or $50 in bribes, families can often go ahead keep the body for the wake. Washing, then hugging and kissing the remains is common, as is a private burial nearby.

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

Obama wants to close Gitmo. Maybe we need to remodel it, or somewhere similar into a quarantine facility for health care workers and other Americans coming back from Africa? So far I believe we just have the CDC setting up some cursory screening of incoming flights at only 5 major airports. Taking people’s temperatures and such. After they’ve already hopped through London or elsewhere.
[/quote]

And I love how these idiots are criticizing the health care professionals, blaming a “breach in protocol”. Assholes! Yeah there is a breach in protocol, it’s called no damn flights from anyone from W.Africa! Ebola will be claiming 10k a week soon over there.

I think traditionally Ebola ends when it “exhausts the host population”. That’s a fuckin scary thought. God Bless those health care workers. We owe them our respect and gratitude.

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:

For $40 or $50 in bribes, families can often go ahead keep the body for the wake. Washing, then hugging and kissing the remains is common, as is a private burial nearby.

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

[/quote]

let them perish… you can’t help people who are too primitive to understand the relationship between cause and effect.

[quote] Powerpuff wrote:

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

[/quote]

Resign.

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:

For $40 or $50 in bribes, families can often go ahead keep the body for the wake. Washing, then hugging and kissing the remains is common, as is a private burial nearby.

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

[/quote]

let them perish… you can’t help people who are too primitive to understand the relationship between cause and effect. [/quote]

Life is really cheap in some parts of the world where customs transcend practical applications of a little knowledge. Quite possible they have no understanding of the disease and how it is transmitted. The body counts in these back-assward parts of the world are going to be staggering.

[quote]beachguy498 wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:

For $40 or $50 in bribes, families can often go ahead keep the body for the wake. Washing, then hugging and kissing the remains is common, as is a private burial nearby.

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

[/quote]

let them perish… you can’t help people who are too primitive to understand the relationship between cause and effect. [/quote]

Life is really cheap in some parts of the world where customs transcend practical applications of a little knowledge. Quite possible they have no understanding of the disease and how it is transmitted. The body counts in these back-assward parts of the world are going to be staggering.
[/quote]

It’s not that they don’t understand it’s that they don’t believe it. They think it doesn’t exist at all or that it’s being deliberately spread by white people or that it’s just a pretext to get black people into clinics where they can be murdered and have their blood stolen for use in sorcery and so on. Western health workers going there to help them are getting bashed to death and having their throats slit and so on. People need to understand what these societies are actually like. Europe in the Dark Ages was a hundred times more advanced than most of these societies are today. And yet the concept of mass immigration and cultural diversity enjoys uncontested ideological sovereignty.

The amount of propaganda used to distort what really goes on in Africa is staggering. It really took a foothold in the 1980s from government/religious/and aid organizations. And the reason is simple: If people understood how the natives live/believe/act they would simply be appalled and wouldn’t send a dime.

Cleveland schools close over Ebola concerns.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/cleveland-area-schools-cancel-classes-over-ebola-concerns/ar-BB9nPeS

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]beachguy498 wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:

For $40 or $50 in bribes, families can often go ahead keep the body for the wake. Washing, then hugging and kissing the remains is common, as is a private burial nearby.

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

[/quote]

let them perish… you can’t help people who are too primitive to understand the relationship between cause and effect. [/quote]

Life is really cheap in some parts of the world where customs transcend practical applications of a little knowledge. Quite possible they have no understanding of the disease and how it is transmitted. The body counts in these back-assward parts of the world are going to be staggering.
[/quote]

It’s not that they don’t understand it’s that they don’t believe it. They think it doesn’t exist at all or that it’s being deliberately spread by white people or that it’s just a pretext to get black people into clinics where they can be murdered and have their blood stolen for use in sorcery and so on. Western health workers going there to help them are getting bashed to death and having their throats slit and so on. People need to understand what these societies are actually like. Europe in the Dark Ages was a hundred times more advanced than most of these societies are today. And yet the concept of mass immigration and cultural diversity enjoys uncontested ideological sovereignty.[/quote]

My experience in Africa was thousands of miles away and limited to SOCAFRICA, which, to me, meant a free trip to Italy. The one thing I remember (besides the 1,000s of bugs and diseases endemic to that shithole of a continent) was that there are probably 100 or more very distinct “peoples” of Africa that are ethnically, religiously, and even physiologically different from each other as any human is to any other human. Think pigmies and Zulu.

“Blacks” in the USA are not remotely the same group of people as we are talking about. Completely different ethnic groups. In fact, USA blacks (generally freed slaves) went to Liberia and ran the country for the better part of a century before being overrun by “native” people.

Anyway, the majority “native” people of Liberia are the Kepelle(sp?).

The Kepelle median/mode IQ is 67, which is right in the middle of “moderate” Downs’ Syndrome IQ for Westerners. This low IQ is pretty common for this particular shithole corner of a shithole continent. An Western average 100 IQ person is a fricking super genius there, with .1% of the people having that IQ.

In short, they are idiots and do idiotic things.

[quote]Aragorn wrote:

[quote]Sifu wrote:
What bothers me is all the attention is on human to human transmission while they have been very sloppy about preventing transmission to other animals. When they cleaned up the vomit from Texas victims parking lot all they did was hose it into a storm sewer with plain water. So now there could be rats in the sewers that are infected.

I think a scary scenario would be the creation of a reservoir of the disease in the wild. Then we have random outbreaks like they have in Africa. [/quote]

You’re kidding me! They didn’t seriously just hose off the vomit did they??[/quote]

Mexican guy wearing shorts sprayed it off with a power washer. He’s a dead man.

[quote]NorCal916 wrote:
Cleveland schools close over Ebola concerns.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/cleveland-area-schools-cancel-classes-over-ebola-concerns/ar-BB9nPeS[/quote]

And so it starts. I ran into a lady I know at the bar last night. She goes to Planet Fitness and she got home yesterday to a recorded message from them… stating that the facility will be closed for 2-3 weeks to finish renovations. From what she says, the whole place was renovated top to bottom back in May or June.

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

The Kepelle median/mode IQ is 67, which is right in the middle of “moderate” Downs’ Syndrome IQ for Westerners. This low IQ is pretty common for this particular shithole corner of a shithole continent. An Western average 100 IQ person is a fricking super genius there, with .1% of the people having that IQ.

In short, they are idiots and do idiotic things.[/quote]

This statement is so absolutely stupid.

How would you expect someone with crappy education to perform on an IQ test designed for someone with some education.

The issue here is lack of education not some inherent racial difference in intelligence.

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]beachguy498 wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:

For $40 or $50 in bribes, families can often go ahead keep the body for the wake. Washing, then hugging and kissing the remains is common, as is a private burial nearby.

So, if you were in charge here what would you do?

[/quote]

let them perish… you can’t help people who are too primitive to understand the relationship between cause and effect. [/quote]

Life is really cheap in some parts of the world where customs transcend practical applications of a little knowledge. Quite possible they have no understanding of the disease and how it is transmitted. The body counts in these back-assward parts of the world are going to be staggering.
[/quote]

It’s not that they don’t understand it’s that they don’t believe it. They think it doesn’t exist at all or that it’s being deliberately spread by white people or that it’s just a pretext to get black people into clinics where they can be murdered and have their blood stolen for use in sorcery and so on. Western health workers going there to help them are getting bashed to death and having their throats slit and so on. People need to understand what these societies are actually like. Europe in the Dark Ages was a hundred times more advanced than most of these societies are today. And yet the concept of mass immigration and cultural diversity enjoys uncontested ideological sovereignty.[/quote]

My experience in Africa was thousands of miles away and limited to SOCAFRICA, which, to me, meant a free trip to Italy. The one thing I remember (besides the 1,000s of bugs and diseases endemic to that shithole of a continent) was that there are probably 100 or more very distinct “peoples” of Africa that are ethnically, religiously, and even physiologically different from each other as any human is to any other human. Think pigmies and Zulu.

“Blacks” in the USA are not remotely the same group of people as we are talking about. Completely different ethnic groups. In fact, USA blacks (generally freed slaves) went to Liberia and ran the country for the better part of a century before being overrun by “native” people.

Anyway, the majority “native” people of Liberia are the Kepelle(sp?).

The Kepelle median/mode IQ is 67, which is right in the middle of “moderate” Downs’ Syndrome IQ for Westerners. This low IQ is pretty common for this particular shithole corner of a shithole continent. An Western average 100 IQ person is a fricking super genius there, with .1% of the people having that IQ.

In short, they are idiots and do idiotic things.[/quote]

In the face of widespread moronocy… they should be doing far worse with the big E than they are. Unless it is vastly under-reported.

The .1% of the rocket-scientist populance are the ones wielding the flame throwers and MAC10s to keep the lid on the ebola cesspool.

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

The Kepelle median/mode IQ is 67, which is right in the middle of “moderate” Downs’ Syndrome IQ for Westerners. This low IQ is pretty common for this particular shithole corner of a shithole continent. An Western average 100 IQ person is a fricking super genius there, with .1% of the people having that IQ.

In short, they are idiots and do idiotic things.[/quote]

This statement is so absolutely stupid.

How would you expect someone with crappy education to perform on an IQ test designed for someone with some education.

The issue here is lack of education not some inherent racial difference in intelligence.[/quote]

#1 They used all sorts of IQ tests, including non-written ones. All pretty much come out the same.

#2 It’s not “racial,” despite what race-obsessed liberals like you think. There are lots of factors that go into intelligence, from hygiene, to prenatal care, to the fact that most women in Liberia have STDs that rot the brain of their kids. Regardless of the cause, the end result is an IQ of 67.

Seriously Pittbull, your liberal talking point bullshit is old and stupid.

I think you need to go on a fact-finding-tour of Liberia and figure it out. We’ll all chip in for a one-way-ticket to your paradise of Liberia.

MOVE ALONG…NOTHING TO SEE HERE, PLEASE DISPERSE!

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

The Kepelle median/mode IQ is 67, which is right in the middle of “moderate” Downs’ Syndrome IQ for Westerners. This low IQ is pretty common for this particular shithole corner of a shithole continent. An Western average 100 IQ person is a fricking super genius there, with .1% of the people having that IQ.

In short, they are idiots and do idiotic things.[/quote]

This statement is so absolutely stupid.

How would you expect someone with crappy education to perform on an IQ test designed for someone with some education.

The issue here is lack of education not some inherent racial difference in intelligence.[/quote]

#1 They used all sorts of IQ tests, including non-written ones. All pretty much come out the same.

#2 It’s not “racial,” despite what race-obsessed liberals like you think. There are lots of factors that go into intelligence, from hygiene, to prenatal care, to the fact that most women in Liberia have STDs that rot the brain of their kids. Regardless of the cause, the end result is an IQ of 67.

Seriously Pittbull, your liberal talking point bullshit is old and stupid.

I think you need to go on a fact-finding-tour of Liberia and figure it out. We’ll all chip in for a one-way-ticket to your paradise of Liberia.[/quote]

Not Pittbull. Also I’m not really a liberal more a pragmatist.

With respect to #1 I wonder how we would do on an IQ test devised by a Liberian villager? Are the skills required to live there different to those required to live in a western country?

Your point #2 was what I was getting at. Education level probably dominates that list though. Prenatal care and general nutrition level throughout childhood must be huge factors as well. Having said this… The statement ‘most women in Libera have STDs’… Is any reference for it?

Regardless the problem in Africa is largely (wilful) ignorance rather than low IQ. In other African countries where ebola is more common they manage quite well i.e. effective quarantine (see for example the other ebola outbreak that occurred this summer that is already over). Also some areas in the currently affected countries have managed to stop ebola spreading.

What scares me more right now is the complete inability of western countries to implement basic quarantine measures (i.e. letting that nurse get on a plane, washing the sick down a drain, sending the US patient 0 back home, the total clusterfuck that happened when some suspected patients turned up in hospitals in London recently, the fact that patients with suspected ebola are actually going to hospital rather than calling up and getting collected by people in full rubber suits, letting health workers return from afflicted regions and just mingle freely etc) the list goes on with a level of incompetence that staggers me.

[quote]NorCal916 wrote:
Cleveland schools close over Ebola concerns.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/cleveland-area-schools-cancel-classes-over-ebola-concerns/ar-BB9nPeS[/quote]

I didn’t read this as a bad thing but rather as a group of people who are finally taking some precautionary measures to head off any possible outbreaks instead of going about business as usual in the hopes that nothing happens, then finding themselves behind the 8 ball when it does. The headlines make it sound like a bad situation but in reality it is probably the best way they can handle it.