[quote]djohns wrote:
You know, I feel this way about both sides. Neither side wants to consider the other. It’s really become a sports team mentality.[/quote]
As long as Americans treat politics as a ‘sports team mentality’ we all lose.
Our system is good but people F it up.
Well… I’m waiting for ZEB, hedo, rainjack, and the rest of the Dubya possie to attack me. Come on guys, the reason I stopped posting the first time was because I was always ignored (I mean, even Al Shades got responses). Aren’t you mad that I told you to shove your oh-so-precious American flag up your ass?
Well ya, Al Shades got responses, but not for his observations and conclusions regarding the history of Americas’ policies, both domestic and abroad. He got responses because he was a goof ball.
Good post. You hold your own very well.
Thanks. I just can’t helped feeling that I’m just being passed over and ignored (maybe because I’m a teenager, or an alleged communist (I"m not Cream), or I’m neither a liberal nor a conservative), especially when every extremist on each side gets a 200+ response thread when he complains about the navy destroying guatemalan stinkflies or moveon.org showing commie symptoms. Probably just childish of me (after all, I’m basically just screaming for attention to my posts), because everyone knows that the discussions here are anything but childish. 
[quote]mindeffer01 wrote:
Wow that is something.
Did you ever notice that people of different political views have a different perspective that coresponds with their political view?
Thats the difference.
[/quote]
Exactly. But if the current government is conservative, and you disagree with their views, you’re an unpatriotic traitor. That seems to be the view of many Bush boosters, for example the jerk-off who started this thread.
Just as I expected from the extreme lib’s, always having to resort to name calling.
What did I call you? I tried to parallel your ‘rant’ with counterpoints to everything you said. Please, be so kind as to point out my insults. Or better yet, how about you provide a retort to my counterargument. Just show me where I said anything false or went out of line.
[quote]nopal_juventus wrote:
What did I call you? I tried to parallel your ‘rant’ with counterpoints to everything you said. Please, be so kind as to point out my insults. Or better yet, how about you provide a retort to my counterargument. Just show me where I said anything false or went out of line.[/quote]
He wasn’t talking to you, kiddo. He was talking to deano.
My bad. I’ve just grown accustomed to being called a lib.
[quote]derek wrote:
I cannot argue very many points here. Let’s be fair and give us a brief rundown of the points you disagree with. It’s just not right to make a blanket statement about someones post without an explaination. Ad hominem attack anyone?[/quote]
Maybe so, but the entire original post was a Straw Man fallacy. Here is a quick rundown I googled:
Description of Straw Man
The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person’s actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position. This sort of “reasoning” has the following pattern:
Person A has position X.
Person B presents position Y (which is a distorted version of X).
Person B attacks position Y.
Therefore X is false/incorrect/flawed.
This sort of “reasoning” is fallacious because attacking a distorted version of a position simply does not constitute an attack on the position itself. One might as well expect an attack on a poor drawing of a person to hurt the person.
For example, the original poster wrote,
“If liberals had their way they would take more of my hard earned money and give it to people who don’t want to work for a living.”
Rather than contest the merits of liberal arguements for federal funding of a social welfare system, he submits a twisted and exagerated version of those arguements and attacks them instead in an attempt to discredit liberals.
That would be like if someone wrote that conservatives would rather let poor children starve to death than spend a dime of their own money to help anyone but themselves. This is a false and exagerated version of a conservative arguement used to discredit the merits of conservative arguements for low taxation and against large social spending.
These kinds of arguements are either malicious, or a product of ignorance. Either the original poster just wanted to stir people up and get attention (which I am inclined to believe based on his request for flames) or he is just unintelligent. I wouldn’t expect any intelligent conservative to support what he wrote for fear of losing credibility (aside from the fact that is not true), nor would I expect any intelligent liberal to take what he wrote seriously and argue back because it would be a waste of time. This is not political discourse, it is just stupidity at work.
[quote]nopal_juventus wrote:
Did you ever notice that the same conservatives are the ones who call anyone who disagrees with them unpatriotic?[/quote]
Didn’t you also write this lovely gem down below?
“If you don’t realize that loving your country and being a patriot are two different things, that you can love your country without loving your government, then please shove your oh-so-precious American flag up your ass.”
Shove my flag up my ass? Perhaps I could suggest you try to squeeze the turds from your brain. You are not patriotic when you say that you hate America. Patriotism is exactly defined as a love for your country, they are NOT two different things. Nobody is saying that being against Bush is being unpatriotic, because I am living proof. Pretty much the only thing I agree with Bush is the Iraq invasion. Otherwise, I am decidedly anti-Bush.
Note that I can do this anti-Bush thingy without resorting to spreading lies about the man: “Bush lied, people died, wah wah.” Notice I can be very unconservative about issues like gay marriage, abortion, stem cell research, etc., and not resort to calling our president a fucking moron. Have an iota of respect for differing viewpoints, and then maybe they will have an ounce of respect for you.
It’s called talking heads and politics. The liberals say that it’s stupid to disagree with them. SFW.
What’s your point? That patriotism can be bad? That doesn’t make ALL patriotism bad, sorry. Nice try, though. I always love it when someone throws a reference to the slave-owning south or Hitler’s Germany when talking about our country. Remember to flush after you get those doodoo stickies out of your head.
I don’t think it’s perfect, but it’s the best anybody’s got. If you can come up with something better, then share with the rest of us your vision for a better world. I am an optimist myself, so it’s not very hard for me to see the sunny side of things. You find what you look for… if you only look for the bad side of things, then that is what you will see. You don’t have it so bad… try to cheer up, pooky.
Because gun possession gives you some measure of power. People who are afraid of power being in the hands of the citizenry are the ones trying to remove the guns from them. Can you trust me with the right and responsibility to defend myself with deadly force? I am not going to go on a rampage with my firearm. But God help you if you invade my home with “felonious intent” of some kind, because then you will have a hole in you… bullet wounds hurt. I am man enough to take responsibility for my own safety, thank you very much.
[quote]Surely not everyone here is a bloodlusting hunter. If conservatives had their way they would make special laws for speeding up the death penalty for:
a.)minorities
b.)liberals
c.)unpatriotic people
Yet why is it that if there’s supposed to be a seperation between church and state, most people vote and act according to the bible?[/quote]
Whine.
I’m a massive atheist, and yet I see nothing wrong with the phrase “Under God”. Imagine that. What is so threatening about that phrase? Why would a bunch of liberal wimps want to remove those few traditional religious references in our public discourse?
Oh, and if someone votes the way their religious beliefs demand of them, and you don’t like it, that is tough shit. It is not your business to stick your nose into how somebody chooses to vote. They matter just as much as you do, even if you think that they are stupid.
Please explain how you can call snipeout ridiculous for his hyperbole, but you aren’t being ridiculous here yourself.
Yeah, the military is full of naive guys and gals who are only there to get oil for Bush’s business partners. Wow, how original. But you are young, and After the steady diet of ultraliberal BS you’ve been feeding yourself, I guess I can understand why you would type something like this. Good luck with that.
I will say that mandatory military service is probably a bad idea.
[quote]If you don’t realize that loving your country and being a patriot are two different things, that you can love your country without loving your government, then please shove your oh-so-precious American flag up your ass. Maybe that way you’ll realize that the people who live in a country and the culture(s) that give it identity are far more important than any lofty ideals the government is spoon-feeding you.[/quote] Again with this lovely passage. Just one thing:
What happens when those “lofty ideals” being “spoon-fed” to us are responsibility, strength, education, and love of family and community? Yeah, that sounds terrible, doesn’t it?
BTW: I have nothing against celebrating the diversity of other cultures, in fact I partake in quite a bit of revelry in that manner. But you cannot advance these differing cultures at the expense of our rules and regulations. This is a mutual respect thing.
I’m sorry, but the reason you have a photo on your driver’s license is because we need to know what you look like. You cannot wear your face covered in muslim fashion for your driver’s license picture.
I’m sorry, but the reason we have welfare in this country is to help people on an emergency temporary basis who find themselves in a bind. If you are here illegally from Mexico, and sucking the tit of American welfare, you are fucking it up for the people who truly need and deserve it.
The way I see it, conservatives in general are threatened by change, which is a nice balance for liberals, who can barely form two coherent sentences before spewing an epithet of some kind disparaging Bush. Geez, you’d think the guy was the liberal version of the antichrist or something. He’s not that bad. A little close-minded, maybe, but I guess that’s what makes him so appealing to the conservative crowd.
What is the liberal message? Did you ever notice that there isn’t one? What a shame.
[quote]snipeout wrote:
WARNING: THIS IS A RANT!!
Did you ever notice that conservatives on the whole defend their country and love it and only seem to talk about what is right with country. In contrast liberals always find what is wrong with the country and harp on it, no matter how insignificant the wrong is.
Did you ever notice that liberals are more concerned with protecting the criminal than the law abiding citizen.
As an example of my last statement I will use the ACLU(liberal entity) defending all the Gitmo terrorists. Yet if liberals had their way(for the most part) they would revoke my right -as a law abiding citizen- to have a gun. If liberals had their way they would also ban the death penalty of convicted heinous murderers. Yet in the same breath think nothing of abortion.
In my opinion the death penalty is nothing more than an abortion that has been delayed by about 25 years(give or take a few).
If liberals had their way they would take more of my hard earned money and give it to people who don’t want to work for a living.
I got news for you folks if you want a socialist society join the military: healthcare for EVERYONE, same pay for same rank regardless of how much actual work you do and you get to serve and protect your country. The only thing you have to do to obtain this socialist utopia I call the military is have no physical disabilities and have no serious crimes on your record.
The only problem is that liberals hate this country so much, they don’t think we should have a military.
As a sidenote, I did serve 6 years in the army, active duty, it was the best and worst 6 years of my life.
Overall I loved it and it gave me a love for my country and wanting to protect it and everyone in this country, which leads me to my next point. Mandatory military service, 2 years for all males. It would mature these boys beyond belief and easily cut the crime rate by 2/3’s. It may also give all these borderline lib’s a new found love for their country.
If you don’t love this country I say leave it, I’m not saying you don’t have the right to hate this country, but if you think we suck just LEAVE. Go somewhere else and see if the grass is greener, then comeback if it isn’t, if it is, drop me a line.
The US is not perfect, but we have never slaughtered millions of our own, nor have we oppressed anyone with our beliefs. As a matter of fact we have led the charge head on to fight oppressive regimes and maniacal leaders.
I’m ready for the responses and flames from all.[/quote]
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…huh…what? Oh, same old shit.
For the love of God, would someone please come up with something new?
[quote]mindeffer01 wrote:
Wow that is something.
Did you ever notice that people of different political views have a different perspective that coresponds with their political view?
Thats the difference.
[/quote]
Dude, you just blew my mind. Wow…