Can I Mix Test E with EQ?

Pharma / TRT
21

[quote]TheBeat2 wrote:
ironjoe wrote:
Brook wrote:
1ml of Eq and 1ml of TE equals 1ml of each in a syringe… this goes for all the oil based steroids AFAIK.

Think about it like this, you fill the syringe slowly, with no air - just perfectly filled to the 1ml line with Eq, then pull the pin out of the vial, and insert it into the Test vial. then turn it upside down and slowly draw the oil out… so no air is drawn - just oil.

When the mark gets to 2ml, that will be 1ml of each substance, by default. Seeing as there was only room for 1ml of the second liquid left in the barrel after the first draw.

Now a ml of Eq may weigh less/more than a ml of TE but they are both millilitres.

I know what your thinking and i agree it seems logical but its not the way it works. the point is that because they have two separate densities you can’t assume they aren’t mixing to some degree for a visual think about adding sand to a jar of rocks.

the sand can easily fit between the rocks so although you’re adding something the volume doesn’t change proportionally. The same is true with liquids.

lets say your test is dosed at 250mg/1ml and you’re EQ is dosed at 300mg/ml. Both esters weight the same amount and the the base of test is only 2mg heavier then EQ.

The density of the EQ+ester would be about 30% greater then that of the test because of the difference in mg/ml (density is determined by mass/volume). The denser the product the less room there is in between each molecule.

However because the test has less molecules in the same volume it can “fit” between the molecules of the EQ. Hence 1ml of Test + 1ml of EQ is less then 2ml when combined.
Sorry bud, but I don’t know where you took physics or if you even did, but your thinking is a phallacy.

Volume is volume and 60ml of oil mixed with 60ml of water is 120ml of volume - try it yourself. Your thinking with the compounds is clever, but unfortunately collapsed in it’s logic. Density will have to do with mixing and not volume in most cases.

Comparing rocks and sand to liquids and the molecular structure is where I think you are getting confused and the volume within the total compound may be different leading to different viscousities - but the same physical volume. I like how you try to break it all down, but you are complicating something that Mr. Wizard taught most of us a long time ago.

[/quote]

I gotta agree with thebeat2 and Brook.

Secondly, let me throw you guys another curve. Here: don’t forget that when you fill your first 1 mL, that there is some oil in the needle, so if you don’t swap needles for the second oil, you are gonna have about 0.1-0.15 mL less of the second oil or suspension… :slight_smile:

23

[quote] Brook wrote:
ironjoe wrote:
Brook wrote:

Water doesnt mix with an oil like it would if it went ‘between the spaces’ it simply doesnt mix at all… because of the fact that oil is denser, it has a higher mass and therefore it is heavier, so the water floats on TOP of the oil… not inbetween the particles.

JJ[/quote]

Sorry, that is wrong… water is denser than oil, so the oil floats on top of the water in most cases.

JJ

24

[quote]AlteredState wrote:
Bloody hell guys, way to overcomplicate things, haha :wink:

Yes you can mix two oil based drugs in the same barrel. You can even mix oil and water in the same barrel, though they don’t actually ‘mix’ since they are immisible.

Personally I don’t change the needles. Yes you may have a tiny amount still in the needle, but if you think you can use the gradations on the barrel to 100% accurately measure your dose, you have far better eyesight and motor control of your hands than I do. The ‘error’ induced by using the same needle is probably less than the error induced by using eyesight/gradations anyway, IMO.

And oil floats on water, not the other way around. That’s why we have oil slicks ;)[/quote]

LOL! I just read that!

by the way, the amount of ‘product’ that is in the needle attachment isnt counted in the measurement. the measurements on a syringe barrel are began at the base of the barrel, not at the tip of the needle, as that part of the product is never used.

But while it wont affect the measurement one gets into the system, it does waste that tiny amount - which can add up over time.

Altered, i was looking forward to hearing your views on the debate above, as i believe virtually everything you tell me!

Am i correct or is IronJoe correct? Do you know?

26

isnt that like saying a pound of rocks weighs more than a pound of feathers… 60 plus 60 equals 120 no matter what

27

To add the strangness of this whole debate over whether 1 ml = 1 ml, you aren’t actually “mixing” things.

Not in the same sense as if you had a beaker and poured two different liquids in to a certain measured level. What you are doing is drawing a plunger back to a prescribed mark on the barrel. You aren’t using the liquid level to measure it, you are just pulling back a plunger over a particular range.

And once again, 1 ml is 1 ml. Or is this a Caterpiller type riddle “When is a ml not a ml?”…he says puffin on his hookah.

28

[quote]ironjoe wrote:
Lol this has nothing do with physics, its chemistry, look it up bitches! it works!

And no, 60ml of oil and 60ml of water mixed is not 120ml! you need to try it first. You’ll be surprised.[/quote]
Bitches? I bet you tried mixing your 1/2 cups of water and oil together and feel like an ass now don’t you? It’s ok, we’re all her to learn and I hope you walked away from this thread with some simple logic.

29

[quote]AlteredState wrote:
But if you withdraw the needle from the septa and then draw air into the barrel before you change over to your injection pin, you don’t waste any gear.

[/quote]

That was my implication from my previous post. You said it better than i could :slight_smile:

30

there is a difference in mixing oil and water and then mixing oil and oil. u cant mix a water based compound with a oil base because it will not be 1+1=2 but since they r both oils u can mix them and get 1+1=2. try adding 1/2 cup of oil a plus 1/2 cup of a different oil and u will get 1 it all depends on the substances being mixed

31

[quote]Game_over wrote:
isnt that like saying a pound of rocks weighs more than a pound of feathers… 60 plus 60 equals 120 no matter what[/quote]

Measure out 50 ml of water and 50 ml of rubbing alcohol, mix them together, and record the total volume. Measure it as closely as you can. I understand where ironjoe is coming from, but it would be such a small difference that it’s not worth bothering about, assuming it does the same thing anyways.

32

[quote]andwhat wrote:
there is a difference in mixing oil and water and then mixing oil and oil. u cant mix a water based compound with a oil base because it will not be 1+1=2 but since they r both oils u can mix them and get 1+1=2. try adding 1/2 cup of oil a plus 1/2 cup of a different oil and u will get 1 it all depends on the substances being mixed[/quote]

This thread has turned to nonsense. I see your point, but you are also implying that mixing 1/2 cup of water and 1/2 cup of oil will not make 1 cup. Please try it before you post that! I challenge anyone to mix 1/2 cup of water and 1/2 cup of oil and not get 1 cup, or even two different oils! Go ahead… Try it - IT’S A CHALLENGE!!!

Now in Home Ec, which is where Joe got confused, is where they teach you that mixing 1/2 cup of SUGAR and 1/2 cup of WATER will not get you 1 cup, but with liquids or mass it does.

Joe also got confused on the chemistry part and thought that physics no longer mattered if he was making up an equation - all science matters in relation to the final outcome - you cannot defy the laws of physics because you are mixing two different compounds and say it’s chemistry instead.

Let’s step back and collect ourselves, and let common sense and what we learned in kindergarten; level us back to reality, and forget arguing for the sake of arguing when the answer is so basic I don’t understand why we are arguing?

33

[quote]Thatguy1083 wrote:
Game_over wrote:
isnt that like saying a pound of rocks weighs more than a pound of feathers… 60 plus 60 equals 120 no matter what

Measure out 50 ml of water and 50 ml of rubbing alcohol, mix them together, and record the total volume. Measure it as closely as you can. I understand where ironjoe is coming from, but it would be such a small difference that it’s not worth bothering about, assuming it does the same thing anyways.[/quote]

There is no difference in volume with Oil and Water, or really since the point was in regards to oil and oil - no difference.

The reason why we see a difference with alcohol is when alcohol and water mix the resulting volume of the two solutions is less than the total of the individual volumes because the decrease in volume can be attributed to the hydrogen bonds which develop between the alcohol molecules and the water molecules.

This hydrogen bond pulls the molecules really close to each other and the small water molecules will fit nicely in the spaces between the alcohol molecules.

With Oil and water - Intermolecular bonds are exactly the reason why they don’t mix. Water molecules have strong bonds with one another, called “hydrogen bonds.” This consists of an extraordinarily strong attraction that the hydrogens of one H2O have for oxygens of nearby H2O molecules.

Oil molecules also have very strong bonds with one another, but not hydrogen bonds. Oil molecules are bonded to one another by what are called “London forces,” or sometimes “dispersion forces.” This is a little harder to explain in simple terms, but basically the large oil molecules tend to clump together because of these forces.

However, an oil molecule does not hydrogen bond with a water molecule, and an oil molecule’s dispersion attraction to a water molecule is weak compared to the oil-oil attraction.

Oil and Oil is like Water and Water or no difference - especially in volume!

34

See I’m not smoking crack! Thanks for clearing that up Beat. It was just something i remembered from high school chem but i guess i was off on what kind of solutions would have a smaller total volume when added together.

35

At last!

Good outcome!

Thanks peeps for an ‘interesting’ thread!

LMAO!

36

along with the having product in the pin part.

has anyone been able to completly empty a pin when you inject.
I know I still have that .1 or whatever of oil left over when ever I shoot.

37

Wow what a wacky thread.

Nich, its not uncommon for there to be a few drip drops in the part of the syringe just before the needle [whatever its called]. You should be able to empty the barrell of the syringe though. Once you have pushed all you can push and you’re just leaving the needle in for those few moments you’ve pretty much done what you can do.

I notice what appears to be oil in the syringe but when you try and push it out once you pull the needle out you realize its not .1cc its far less. In fact I could produce no more than a lone drop ever when I tried to see how much I missed

38

[quote]saps wrote:
Wow what a wacky thread.

Nich, its not uncommon for there to be a few drip drops in the part of the syringe just before the needle [whatever its called]. You should be able to empty the barrell of the syringe though. Once you have pushed all you can push and you’re just leaving the needle in for those few moments you’ve pretty much done what you can do. I notice what appears to be oil in the syringe but when you try and push it out once you pull the needle out you realize its not .1cc its far less. In fact I could produce no more than a lone drop ever when I tried to see how much I missed[/quote]

true,I have had several lone drops find there way back out of my shoulder from time to time.

but being that all answers have been answered in this thread,I have another odd one

how common is it to when you asperiate to pull a great big air bubble from out of your muscle?

39

[quote]Nich wrote:
how common is it to when you asperiate to pull a great big air bubble from out of your muscle?
[/quote]

You’re one lucky man! You accidentally pinned into an artery and suck up a life-ending air embolism that was headed straight for your heart. You should play the lottery!!

That or your Luer lock isn’t fastened down tight enough and is creating an air leak.