CAFTA

Being that 98% of my work deals with the Ag industry of some sort, I have a bit more protectionist view wrt CAFTA.

I have a problem with the levelness of the playing field when it comes to CAFTA flooding the market with commodities that are grown here in the U.S. They have no EPA to regulate the crap out of farming pracices. The have no FDA to regulate the crap out of ranching/veterinary practices.

Yet these commodities will be competing for the same dollar that our domestic farmer/rancher will be competing for. The difference is that C.A. can use pesticides and herbicides that are far more efficient than the hand-cuffed domestic farming industry can use.

More than the farming issues I have, the ranching disparities are very telling especially sonce the vattle industry recieves no subsidies whatsoever.

When NAFTA passed, the cattle markets went limit down every day until you could by a five-weight stocker for less than 80 cents/pound (contrast that with 1.50-1.60 currently as a result of our Mad Cow induced closed border policy).

Just my 2 cents.

rainjack,

That’s an interesting take, which in some ways logically parallels the arugments unions make w/r/t labor-restrictions (though they make it a moral argument and argue that its immoral to trade with countries that don’t have labor laws that push prices up).

I actually think that this is something that could be at least partially addressed by branding and enforcement of trademark laws. If consumers really care about and want all the environmental regulations that supposedly ensure our food is safer, then U.S. farmers should brand the hell out of their products and associate that brand (something like “environmentally certified” or something perhaps more catchy) with having met U.S. environmental and agricultural standards. It would certainly quickly illustrate how much value consumers placed on that sort of protection…

Also, I’m a bit ignorant on this, but I thought that any food product sold in U.S. markets had to meet certain U.S. minimum standards? I don’t know precisely what those are, or how many different bureaucratic agencies regulate, but I did think there were minimum requirements for going to market as far as food safety?

BB -

The problem you have with trying to ‘brand’ a commodity is that, by it’s nature a commodity is brandless. The producer’s that make wheat, or any other commodity, are price takers. They can’t really brand their raw product (wheat, oats, soybeans, corn, or cattle - you get the idea).

It is the middle man, and the end manufacturer (the bread company, the meat company,etc.) that can brand and differentiate his product. He can buy his raw materials from where ever they are the cheapest. Branding doesn’t really come into play when the middle man makes a purchasing decision.

And I would differentiate the labor union guy, and the farmer. The farmer will make his crop, regardless of gov’t intrusion. He is the most efficient producer on the planet. The same can’t be said for the union laborer. The farmer just wants a fair price for his product, and the union guy just wants to keep his job and his benefits.

rainjack,

Very true on the “branding the commodity” aspect – I did have end-products in mind when I wrote that. I suppose there is at least one, if not more, layer of separation between the producer and the wholesale supplier to the grocers.

But in the end I don’t see much in the way of another solution. Well, that’s not entirely true. We could always scale back our bureaucratic oversight… I’ll not speculate on the likeliehood of that. I would say that if a wholesaler did try the branding strategy, we’d end up with some good data on how much consumers value being protected.

We can’t really force other countries to meet our environmental standards – but I do think we can enforce exactly parallel minimum-safety standards on foreign and domestic producers. That should help assuage some of the problem at least – though I’m not certain whether the federal bureaucracies will assign enough inspectors to actually enforce any minimum standards on imported foodstuffs.

so the votes coming tonight. Bush was up here this morning whipping support for the legislation, and Portman was going office to office to ensure that it passes. Interstingly enough, the house is holding off on the conference report of the transportation bill so that they can pull projects from people who dont vote for CAFTA…should make for an interesting vote.

BB -

The inability for us to level the international playing field, or our inability to remove production hidrances from the producer are the major reasons I have a little problem with “Free Trade”.

What will wind up happening is that gov’t subsidies will increase, and the farmer will become even more dependent on the Fed. Never mind the fact that it will increase gov’t spending.

For the Ag guy - there is no good thing that will come from CAFTA, just like nothing good has come from its big brother, NAFTA.

But aside from the ag issues, I think free trade is the only thing that can help keep our economy growing. Well that, and a devalued dollar.

It’s a go:

Close vote.

Yup. Here’s the WSJ take:

House Narrowly Approves Cafta

Accord Was Tough Sell
For Bush Administration
Amid Globalization Fears
By GREG HITT and NEIL KING JR.
Staff Reporters of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
July 28, 2005; Page A2

WASHINGTON – The Republican-controlled House, voting 217-215, approved the U.S. trade pact with Central America, ending a drawn-out debate that proved much tougher and more passionate than the White House expected.

The Bush administration’s difficulty in selling the Central American Free Trade Agreement – a deal with six countries that collectively export to the U.S. in a year roughly what Mexico exports every five weeks – reflected not just Democratic opposition but broader trepidation about globalization among politicians and their constituents.

With President Bush and Vice President Cheney appealing personally to individual members, the House debated the pact, known as Cafta, late into last night. The agreement is aimed at reducing trade barriers among the U.S. and Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua and the Dominican Republic. Cafta, which already has been approved by the Senate, now returns to that chamber for a final vote that is expected to be a formality.

Cafta has stirred partisan opposition from House Democrats, though it is puny compared with the magnitude of the 1993 North American Free Trade Agreement with Canada and Mexico. More than 100 House Democrats supported President Clinton and voted for Nafta; fewer than 20 backed President Bush on Cafta. Ahead of the vote, Rep. William Jefferson, a Louisiana Democrat, broke ranks with his party and urged lawmakers to consider the U.S.'s unique role in the Western Hemisphere. “At our door stand our neighbors from Central America, literally pleading with us to approve this agreement,” he said. “Instead of turning a deaf ear to them, we ought to heed them.”

The White House also has had difficulty rallying some Republicans to back free trade at a time when China has emerged as a strong economic competitor, the World Trade Organization is pressing Congress to alter laws it has passed, the U.S. trade deficit is on pace to set a new high, workers are worried about outsourcing and wages are stagnant for many despite an expanding economy.

Fierce opposition from organized labor, which cited concern about weak labor-rights protections in Central America, played a role, giving Democrats a reason to rally against the pact beyond simply opposing the initiative because it came from Mr. Bush.

Textile and sugar producers, two powerful domestic industries with particular interests in Central America, also contributed, portraying the pact as a threat to them and draining support among House Republicans.

U.S. textile companies fear increased competition. Supporters countered that the pact would lock in existing relationships that ensure a market for U.S. textile producers. Under the pact, apparel produced in Central America could be shipped to the U.S. duty free if it is fashioned with U.S.-made fabric and yarn.

The pact also allows a modest increase in sugar imports from the region, a provision that had U.S. sugar producers fearing a precedent that would open the door to further competition.

More broadly, opponents tapped into a deeper set of concerns about whether U.S. workers and manufacturers are truly reaping benefits of global markets and more open trade. “This is symbolic of the trade agenda, and America’s role in the global economy,” said Dan Griswold, director of trade studies at the Cato Institute, a Washington think tank that supports free trade.

Indeed, while the economies at issue were small, both proponents and opponents saw the Cafta fight as a referendum on Mr. Bush’s ambitions to further liberalize global trade, a longstanding plank of the Republican Party, as well as an indicator of prospects for continuing talks on a global trade deal, which began in Doha, Qatar, in 2001.

Backers pitched Cafta as a way to build demand for U.S. exports such as pharmaceuticals, grain and construction equipment. But a big part of the White House case also focused on the need to support economic and democratic reforms that have taken root in Central America, a region dominated not long ago by dictators and made unstable by militant insurgencies. In a day of high-level lobbying, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice made the rounds to argue that Cafta would help heal old divisions in the region and foster stability. Late last night, Mr. Cheney camped out in an office just off the House floor, and Commerce Secretary Carlos Gutierrez worked the halls.

The president’s unusual appearance on Capitol Hill, followed up with private telephone calls to wavering members, underscored his personal stake in the fight. More effective in the end-game maneuvering was deal-cutting by Bush aides and Republican leaders. Highway projects were dangled before undecided lawmakers, as well as assignments on top-shelf committees.

“If they voted their conscience, Cafta would fail by 50 votes in the House,” claimed Augustine Tantillo, lobbyist for American Manufacturing Trade Action Coalition, a Cafta foe.

Republican leaders secured at least five votes for Cafta by agreeing to bring separate legislation to the floor that would allow the U.S. to impose duties on exports from China and others designated as nonmarket economies by the Commerce Department. The measure, approved yesterday in the House by a 255-168 vote, was castigated as “a sham” by Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid of Nevada and faces uncertain prospects in the Senate.

Another five votes, and perhaps more, came after the administration cut deals to assuage textile-industry concerns, such as fears that the pact would create incentives for Central American producers to use inexpensive Asian-made yarn and fabric instead of U.S.-made materials. Even with the changes, opposition remained among lawmakers from textile-producing states.

Also, w/r/t sugar prices, I forgot to mention something that may be of interest to people on this site.

To the extent that one thinks high-fructose corn syrup is the most evil of sweeteners, you have the sugar subsidies to thank, at least in part, for its pervasiveness.

If sugar prices weren’t artificially high, then high-fructose corn syrup would not be such an attractive substitute product for foodstuff manufacturers.

Just a small point to consider.

Here’s an opinion column that takes an interesting look at free trade – it’s a plus overall, but that does not mean there aren’t individual winners and losers in terms of both economic sectors and individuals.

CAPITAL
By DAVID WESSEL

Looking Out for Globalization’s Tweeners
July 28, 2005; Page A2

For some Americans, globalization is a clear plus: those who get paid more because their employers excel at exporting and who get more for their money at Wal-Mart because imports are cheaper than home-made stuff. For others, it’s a clear minus: those textile-factory workers whose jobs have gone and who will never get jobs that pay nearly as much as the old ones.

A lot of the debate over the Central American Free Trade Agreement and the like boils down to an argument over whether there are more winners or more losers.

But a lot of Americans are neither big winners nor big losers. Call them tweeners. They’re consumers, as all Americans are, so they enjoy the better quality, lower prices and great choice that imports offer. On the job, they aren’t squeezed hard by overseas competitors but neither do they see much direct benefit from trade. Yet they worry – with some justification – that the combination of globalization, technology and immigration makes their jobs and wages vulnerable. And they fear their children will have even more reason to worry.

An honest weighing of the benefits and risks of globalization requires some focus on these tweeners. The gain from globalization to each is modest, but are there so many of them that the total benefit is huge? If so, lump them with the winners and full speed ahead.

Or are they best described as individuals for whom the benefits of globalization are small and the risks so large, especially given the anxiety that globalization produces about job security and wages, that they’re potential losers. If so, then perhaps the U.S. shouldn’t push so hard for more free-trade pacts. And, no matter which answer is correct, what can the U.S. do to make more of those tweeners – workers, firms, communities – into winners?

On these issues, the congressional debate over Cafta has been marked by a disappointing absence of serious talk about doing something – anything – to put more Americans on the winning side of globalization. The last-minute votes on the trade pact in Congress were sold to protect pockets of textile production or sugar barons, not for promising policy initiatives.

It’s time to stop thinking about globalization as good or bad. It’s both. It’s time to stop treating globalization as (a) a church that the U.S. can join if it wishes or (b) an unstoppable, unmanageable force of Nature. Neither metaphor helps. Falling costs of transportation and communication and a global embrace of markets do make further economic globalization almost certain over the long haul. But the disruption to world trade in the period around World War I proves that bad government policies can disrupt the seemingly inevitable. And the possibility that terrorism will lead nations to fortify their borders is obvious.

Instead, it’s time to better understand the complexities of globalization: What it means for the typical, middle-class tweener and how, together with technological change, it magnifies the difference between being a winner and being a loser. “Deeper American integration with the global economy over the past 30 years has increased the stakes and widened the spreads,” says J. David Richardson, an economist at Syracuse University’s Maxwell School who is writing a book on this subject for the Institute for International Economics, a Washington think tank. “Globalization has helped make favorable outcomes more favorable and unfavorable outcomes more unfavorable…among apparel firms, among high-school-educated workers and among states of the union.”

In the quest for better metaphors, Mr. Richardson sees global markets “as a kind of fitness center” for firms, industries, workers and communities. “Those that are fittest grow prosperous and stably. But others, less fit, grow more sluggishly and fitfully. And still others, who consciously try to avoid global competition, face grave health risks.”

The usual reaction of free traders to yelps from people who are clear losers from globalization is to compensate them, arguing that there are so many winners from globalization that the society can afford to pay off the losers. That’s a reasonable impulse, but it seems to be a losing way to build popular support or to bolster the U.S. edge. One reason: It ignores the tweeners.

A smarter approach would be to make those tweeners more economically fit, to find ways to equip Americans to prosper in an economy in which there are more global competitors and more tasks that computers can do and to insure them against the greater volatility of today’s economy in which today’s winner job can be a loser job tomorrow. Mr. Richardson is still working on that chapter. It’ll surely emphasize the urgent need to do better, much better, at education and training and to expand successful experiments that give workers and companies the incentives to do what’s needed – not to pay off losers but to make more winners.

An interesting look at the increasingly partisan nature of the free-trade divide:

http://www.willisms.com/archives/2005/07/a_cafta_squeake.html

A CAFTA Squeaker: Democrats Run Left.
After passing the Senate 54-45 ( http://wizbangblog.com/archives/006341.php ) late last month, the House of Representatives approved the Dominican Republic-Central America-United States Free Trade Agreement ( http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/t2GPO/http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=109_cong_bills&docid=f:h3045rh.txt.pdf ) (DR-CAFTA) 217-215, in a vote that went right down to the wire.

In 1993, 102 Democrats (40% of the party) voted for NAFTA, while 43 Republicans (24% of the party) voted against it. Overall, it passed 234-200.

In 2005, 15 Democrats (7% of the party) voted for CAFTA, while 27 Republicans (12% of the party) voted against it.

The trend was similar in the Senate vote ( U.S. Senate: U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes 109th Congress - 1st Session ) , with Democrats running from trade from 1993 to 2005 ( http://wizbangblog.com/archives/006341.php ), and Republicans more-or-less holding steady on the issue over that time frame.

The Associated Press puts its own spin on the squeaker 217-215 vote:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2005/07/27/national/w210903D64.DTL

To capture a majority, supporters had to overcome what some have called free trade fatigue, a growing sentiment that free trade deals such as the North American Free Trade Agreement with Mexico and Canada have contributed to a loss of well-paying American jobs and the soaring trade deficit.

A growing sentiment, eh?

That’s one way to put it, I guess.

UPDATE:

The Democratic Leadership Council, which propelled Bill Clinton to office as a “New Democrat,” once set itself apart from the Democratic Party of Walter Mondale and Michael Dukakis with support for free trade. Indeed, the DLC is still for free trade today ( http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?kaid=108&subid=900010&contentid=253428 ).

But even House Democrats associated with the DLC have eschewed that whole “New Democrat” thing ( http://gop.com/News/Read.aspx?ID=5685 ).

38 of the 43 DLC House Democrats (88%) voted against CAFTA, while 10 of the 18 DLC Senate Democrats (56%) voted against CAFTA.

What happened to make the DLC so irrelevant?

I have no earthly idea ( DLC makes comeback ), do you?

Man I am so disappointed. It may not be next week but when the tie in with CODEX does take place and we start to see limitations on our supps, I will refer everyone to this post but especially our Bush cheerleaders as a big F-ing “told ya so”

Hmm… This is very interesting. CODEX seems pretty gay. CAFTA seems like a good idea. Its basically economics 101 and has been proven time and time again.

Rainjack, on branding commodities. You ever buy organic food (eggs, chicken, etc.), angus beef, or anything else like that. I think that was what BB was getting at. You could brand a end-market product if you did it the right way. People pay an arm and leg for organic foods that to me don’t make a damn bit of difference. Of course do to being a price taker they would have to try to find a way to get the industry to market it. (Maybe change all those “Beef. Its whats for dinner” to “American Beef. Better than that stuff people the color of turds make.”)

Some of this “Wal-Mart doesn’t help the common man” makes me laugh so hard. Have you ever calculated how much money you save each year from buying stuff at Wal-Mart? Do you know how many other people shop there? Do you know how much money that store is saving your community? If you feel bad for your local hardware/grocery/random other store owner. Just write him a check for the savings, cause even that is more than profits he would have made selling the goods (since he can’t get his goods at the same low rate Wal-Mart does). Just try it out.

CODEX was just voted in but…it appears that 2 Republican votes were not counted and had they been counted the vote would have ended in a tie (217-217).

I could care less about CAFTA but when our supplements get taken away I know who I can blame.

Some interesting politics surrounding the fallout on the vote:

Wall Street Journal Editorial
Cafta Recriminations
August 1, 2005; Page A8

The political recriminations from the cliffhanger passage of the Central American Free Trade Agreement last week are even worse than we thought. Nancy Pelosi, the House Minority Leader, is contemplating revenge against the 15 Democrats who had the nerve to vote for hemispheric growth and progress.

The San Francisco Democrat called a caucus gripe session in the wake of last Wednesday’s vote, and an article in the Capitol Hill newspaper Roll Call suggested that Democrats who voted yes may lose their favorite committee assignments. Our John Fund reports on OpinionJournal.com that Democratic leaders are especially mad at two Black Caucus Members from New York, Edolphus Towns and Gregory Meeks, for voting aye. Apparently if you’re from the financial capital of the world, you’re not supposed to favor free trade.

Given that they may face retribution for doing the right thing, we thought we’d list and salute the other 13 Democrats who supported Cafta: Vic Snyder of Arkansas, Melissa Bean of Illinois, Dennis Moore of Kansas City, William Jefferson of the port of New Orleans, Ike Skelton of Missouri, Jim Cooper and John Tanner of Tennessee, Ruben Hinojosa, Solomon Ortiz and Henry Cuellar of Texas, Jim Matheson of Utah, James Moran of Virginia and Norm Dicks of Washington.

Mr. Cuellar, who holds the seat that runs from San Antonio down to Laredo, was especially gutsy in voting aye. He won a bitter primary last year and has already been targeted by unions for next year because of his Cafta vote. “Since he’s a freshman, we think he’s pretty vulnerable,” Chuck Rocha, political director of the United Steelworkers, recently told Congress Daily. We trust the business community will appreciate that Democrats who break with their party’s new liberal isolationism deserve support.

I could care less how unions feel about this.

What about my supplements?

The fact that Republicans on this site remain silent about CODEX is very telling.

F uncle Ronnie’s 11th commandments!

Show some sack and stickup for yourself!!

Pathetic…

[quote]Marmadogg wrote:
I could care less how unions feel about this.

What about my supplements?

The fact that Republicans on this site remain silent about CODEX is very telling.

F uncle Ronnie’s 11th commandments!

Show some sack and stickup for yourself!!

Pathetic…[/quote]

marmadogg,

Would you mind explaining a couple things for me?

  1. What is the precise threat to supplements?

  2. How is it going to be enforced against the U.S. without a specific bill passed by Congress or regulation passed by the FDA with the implicit approval of Congress, i.e. with specific U.S. government action?