My shbg is mid 20s probably don’t need eod. But you know what we try every fucking protocol anyway to feel the best we can. Will try eventually.
How are you feeling with these numbers and this protocol?
Estrogen is required to produce serotonin. So when it is low people feel extremely depressed. Also low estrogen causes much more fat retention and bloating than high does. I have no idea where people started thinking that high estrogen leads to bloat. Good estrogen levels are key for fat LOSS. Even in female patients - day 14 of their cycle is highest levels of estrogen. Women complain of bloating typically most right before their period when estrogen is low and progesterone is higher. And I hope no one chimes in to say “well that’s women” sorry guys same holds true for men. Also it is when estrogen is lowest a woman (And also a mans) strength is the lowest. So yes itchy nipples for men is a dead give away. Unless someone is extremely overweight or has a liver dysfunction - stay the hell off the AI.
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So if I get itchy nipples what do you do? Is it ok.
I use tamoxifen and lower the dose of testosterone. But also if it’s directly after a dosage increase I leave it alone for six weeks as it typically resolves on its own.
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Ok. How long do you continue tamoxifen or clomid? And dosage? And if nips are itchy one 1 day a week for a short time , I think I can just leave it alone right?
And someone with a shbg in mid 20s do you suggest EOD injections as opposed to 2x a week?
Thank you @physioLojik
Def leave it alone if it’s one day a week and don’t mess with clomid period. If you used tamoxifen it would be at 20mg a day. But you don’t need it. Sometimes it’s actuallt psychological. I really think x2 a week is totally fine. Shbg can swing as high as 30 points in either direction in a 36 hour period. So I would just stick with how you feel and go with two shots a week man
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Ok so the question has been what am I dosing. I am dosing 100mg of T-CYP E3D. I have not been taking my Anastrozole for the last 6 weeks. I will clarify and say one time my breast were tender and I took a .25 mg of Anastrozole.
My SHBG is low 12-15, I am 57, overweight and just had my knee scoped and cleaned up so I am going to get back to working out even if just walking at first.
I feel better fog is gone, more energy, but don’t feel I have it dialed in yet. Usually after dosing my T I get a feeling of a heavy chest, heart rate is up a little, nothing concerning but feel that way, and almost a little like I need my inhaler because my chest is tight if that makes sense. My T numbers were in the 900’s until I backed down to the current protocol of 100 mg E3D. Now they are 647 with 26 Estrogen using the male sensitive panel.
@systemlord and @Hostile have been helping me greatly and it is appreciated. Do you think my dose is too high yet? If so what should I back it down too? I know my E numbers look good, but since my SHBG is so low could that be mistaken and I really have high E? Looking for some help and advice guys.
Your protocol is wrong and will not work, you’re testosterone is ending up in the toilet within a few days do to low SHBG. You must inject 15-20 EOD or 6-10mg every day. 100mg twice weekly is for a high SHBG guy who hyper metabolizes his testosterone.
Chest tightness is elevated estrogen.
@ssauvain @systemlord dude saying his estrogen is the cause for his chest tightness when taking into consideration his age and is his condition fucking irresponsible as hell. Maybe you stop making diagnosises work zero medical training. Perhaps it’s angina. Perhaps it’s digestive. Perhaps it’s aotric dissection. Perhaps it’s pericarditis. Perhaps it’s low hcl. Or an ulcer. Shit I can think of 50 things off the top of my head and is estrogen isn’t one of them. You’re a decently smart guy but a diagnostician isn’t something you are. So stop blaming every god damn thing on estrogen. @anon10035199 Jesus god. Sorry if there are typos I’m on a boat lol. I just had to write this.
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Let’s stop acting like a teenager here and refrain from using foul language, you need to get a grip and lose that huge chip on your shoulder! Chest tightness is common among those with high estrogen.
Lol lose my chip? You knock people in my profession every day on this forum. You think every problem anyone ever has is estrogen, shbg, or thyroid related. Newsflash - it isn’t. Watching the way you toss out medical advice while simultaneously knocking those of us who have dedicated our careers to the study of this specialization in medicine is infuriating. I attend progressive HRT seminars quarterly and I’ve studied with the best TRT docs out there and the info you toss around on here as gospel is just plain wrong. I do think you are an intelligent guy with things to offer - but endocrinology is slightly more complicated than you think. Like the way you think shbg is the “gold standard” for hormone treatment. That particular guy can alter over 30 points in a single day as witnessed by 24 hour screens in our practice. You guys look at a super small window here and think you have all the answers. In reality all you guys do is mess yourselves out by constantly altering your protocols. Neurological effects from hormones can take a full 120 days to manifest fully but by then you guys add AI meds and HCG and alter dosages all over the place. It’s crazy.
When I say most doctors are ill equipped to manage a guy on TRT, I’m not exaggerating. Sure there are those doctors who are extremely knowledgeable in the management of TRT, but when a guy comes in and complains that he feels terrible and his doctor has him injecting testosterone once every 2 weeks (very common) you better believe I’m going to have something to say about it. I’m not going to applaud this doctor and pat him on the back and tell him he’s doing a wonderful job.
The majority of these doctors reflect badly on the current state of hormone management not only in this country but others as well. You can’t denying the current state of hormone management is a big problem, most lack proper training.
@systemlord Here is what I think -I can see your point of view. -Any doc recommending biweekly injects is an idiot. It reminds me of my wife (she’s a cosmetic dermatologist) talking about GPs doing lip and cheek fillers. Yes they can do it. No it isn’t good at all and the outcomes as usually awful. GPs also shouldn’t be doing HRT protocols for their patients. I advise people to seek out endos with a hormone replacement specialty who do CE hours in it specifically. There are definitely bad apples in every bunch.
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So long story short should I do everyday injections? Still with my big needle? No AI?
So what do you think my protocol should be no heart disease history by the way…
@physioLojik @systemlord @Hostile I think there is confusion I inject E3D 50 mg of T-Cyp for a one week total of 100mg. So should I try EOD of 20mg of T-Cyp? What about AI since mine has been consistently in the 20’s?
It’s tempting to start out on the higher end of dosing, but I would start out on the lower end and work my way upwards in dosing. I starting out injecting 25 EOD and it was unbearable, then progressed to 20mg EOD and both time estrogen was a big problem and it wasn’t pleasant.
I would advise you to start low and go slow, 15mg EOD shouldn’t be too aggressive and will cause the least amount of symptoms in relation to estrogen. I take my own advice, I’ve been on 16mg EOD for a week and so far the swings are minimal.
It your estrogen is in the 20’s, leave out the AI for the time being. I really only believe an AI is necessary when symptoms are present, it’s important for bones.
@systemlord @Hostile @physioLojik my current syringe is 21 guage 3ml. So I am injecting .25 on that syringe E3D. You guys are suggesting I do .20 EOD which would get me closer to my Dr.'s original script of .70 once a week. So I think I can do that…my question is the AI, @physioLojik thinks I don’t need it…should I just take it when I get tender breast?
You should be using 27-29 gauge insulin syringes, 21 gauge is completely unnecessary. You could go whale hunting with those harpoons, but seriously you should be injecting using smaller syringes in shoulders and outer quads.
I’m suggesting 15mg EOD, which would be less than 70mg weekly. When you start a new protocol levels will be fluctuating for about 4-6 weeks and then stabilize. Both testosterone and estrogen will rise and fall until finally reaching a stable state, testosterone and estrogen will then become stable and you can reevaluate your symptoms and labs.
Then if you are experiencing high estrogen symptoms you can then decide on a low dosage AI, but trying to evaluate your symptoms halfway between the 4-6 weeks is pointless.
Some doctors are anti-AI and I think it’s a bit short sighted, AI’s have their place and are used when symptoms are present and labs confirm levels are elevated. If only those who dislike AI’s could experience elevated estrogen for themselves they would understand their importance.