Assault on Private Property Rights

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
I think there’s a much better argument that such takings, in the aggregate, effect interstate commerce than the growing of marijuana in someone’s backyard…
[/quote]

I agree, but I would obviously prefer to see a Constitutional Amendment that clarified eminent domain as limited to a transfer from private individual to government, with no transferrability to another private party, and with the requirement that takings must be reserved for the public use of all, which does not include economic “use” or “benefit.”

[quote]nephorm wrote:
pittbulll wrote:
I have known stories of individuals that own property where a freeway is to go and they hold the project for ransom only because they can. I think fair compensation is essential. If there is to be an error it should be on the side of the little person.
You can’t fight City Hall. VOTE!!!

I should clarify that I am not arguing against eminent domain takings as they have been traditionally understood. That is, I have no problem with the government seizing land for a highway or other “public use” project, as long as certain procedures are followed. I have a very large problem with the government taking private land to give to another private entity.

But our government has never been especially fond of the “just compensation” bit, either… the EPA ran roughshod over that for years by designating privately held land as unbuildable because some special species was living there. Essentially, you could go out, by 10 acres to develop on, spend $20 million, and then have the EPA tell you that you were not allowed to develop on your land. Of course, your property would at that point become worthless. IIRC, the Court held that this was not Constitutionally valid, as the government was essentially taking the land as a park without compensating the owner.[/quote]

I agree with you. But the E.P.A. has a vital role. But I feel the do overstep their authority.
Our Government has a long history of treading on the people I would like to see a thread on Social Security.

[quote]
BostonBarrister wrote:
I think there’s a much better argument that such takings, in the aggregate, effect interstate commerce than the growing of marijuana in someone’s backyard…

nephorm wrote:
I agree, but I would obviously prefer to see a Constitutional Amendment that clarified eminent domain as limited to a transfer from private individual to government, with no transferrability to another private party, and with the requirement that takings must be reserved for the public use of all, which does not include economic “use” or “benefit.” [/quote]

I find it amusing, in the tragic sense, that we need to consider an amendment to return to the original meaning of what we already have…

Nephorm,

My God!!!

I’m sorry I insulted you.

I’m going to go lash myself 5,982,232 times for calling you a democrat.

I need a few days off.

JeffR

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
BigMike wrote:
i don’t under stand how this is a liberal decesion. fuckin neo-cons

Did you happen to see the justices who voted in the majority? Four liberals and Kennedy, a squish.

[/quote]

i don’t care what other people lable the justices or what they call them selfs , this is not a liberal decesion.

“How fortunate for rulers that the people do not think.”
— Adolf Hitler

The notion of ‘the good of the community’ has caused more evil and more destruction than just about any idea ever thought up. That catch-phrase has been used by more tyrants to destroy their societies than any other.

“If our country ever falls, it will not be from the outside but from our vandals from within.”
— Abraham Lincoln

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
“How fortunate for rulers that the people do not think.”
— Adolf Hitler

“If our country ever falls, it will not be from the outside but from our vandals from within.”
— Abraham Lincoln[/quote]

Excellent. Two quotes from two despots! :wink:

[quote]JeffR wrote:
I’m going to go lash myself 5,982,232 times for calling you a democrat.
JeffR[/quote]

you’ll prolly just stop at 4,576,489 lashes. slacker!

Boston,

“I find it amusing, in the tragic sense, that we need to consider an amendment to return to the original meaning of what we already have…”

I think, sadly, that sums up everything wrong with the Court in one simple phrase. Well done.

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
I find it amusing, in the tragic sense, that we need to consider an amendment to return to the original meaning of what we already have…[/quote]

It isn’t lost on me… but as a federalist, I can’t abide federal law taking the place of constitutional protections, or interfering with states’ rights (real or perceived). If the SC justices feel that the provision is not suitably clear in this regard, then we ought to clarify it.

Hmmm… I frown on classifying Lincoln with Hitler. Lincoln suspended habeus corpus and ignored a supreme court justice who tried to reverse same. And yes, many were unjustly jailed and so forth. Lincoln was trying to preserve the Union and thought an evil minority of elite whites had captured the South. This differs markedly with the actions of Hitler. Lincoln certainly used total war against civilians, trying to end a national nightmare quickly. That’s not the same as grabbing for Lebensraum.

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Hmmm… I frown on classifying Lincoln with Hitler. [/quote]

I wouldn’t equate them, no. Do they both fall into the classification of “despots?” Probably so. They also belong to the class “human,” as do the rest of us, presumably. As far as Lincoln goes, ends do not justify means.

I couldn’t agree more. In terms of what the government can actually do, these are indeed non-issues. Laws will not force people to be patriotic or heterosexual. Economic issues are real and affect all of us. Unfortunately, most people are ignorant about economics. It’s easy to get emotional over right-to-die and sexual morality issues. Economics just doesn’t get people that worked up.

A developer is seeking to put up a hotel on SC justice Souter’s land…

http://www.freestarmedia.com/hotellostliberty2.html

[quote]nephorm wrote:
A developer is seeking to put up a hotel on SC justice Souter’s land…

http://www.freestarmedia.com/hotellostliberty2.html[/quote]

LMAO Wow, that is just fantastic. I really doubt it will go anywhere, but it certainly would make for a delicious slice of irony.

[quote]nephorm wrote:

I wouldn’t equate them, no. Do they both fall into the classification of “despots?” Probably so. They also belong to the class “human,” as do the rest of us, presumably. As far as Lincoln goes, ends do not justify means.
[/quote]

Lincoln the tyrant? Preserving the Union and freeing the slaves not worth Lincoln ignoring a supreme court justice?

Save the money you were going to spend on guns and invest it in books.

[quote]Cream wrote:
Lincoln the tyrant? Preserving the Union and freeing the slaves not worth Lincoln ignoring a supreme court justice?

Save the money you were going to spend on guns and invest it in books.
[/quote]

I hope you aren’t implying that I’m not well-read. We may disagree as to the correctness of an action, but that doesn’t mean we need to insult each other.

And ftr, “freeing the slaves” was not Lincoln’s goal upon entering the Civil War. Lincoln had stated numerous times that while he was against slavery in general, there would be too much opposition to force the issue.
It’s ok, I understand that people revere the “Great Emancipator,” and it doesn’t matter how he trampled on the rights of his countrymen in the process.

“I hope you aren’t implying that I’m not well-read. We may disagree as to the correctness of an action, but that doesn’t mean we need to insult each other.”

Yes I’m suggesting exactly that. Time to hit the books for a little perspective. The kind of perspective that wouldn’t allow someone to seriously compare Hitler and Abe Lincoln in the same sentence without suffering an explosive aneurism. Medically, this is known as the “ignorant hyperbole syndrome” (see Dick Durbin).

Actually, start out by looking up the word “despot”, and comparing it to how other presidents and then how actual tyrants have acted. Say, FDR? Gelon? Or Hitler, if you’re going to go overboard?

+“And ftr, “freeing the slaves” was not Lincoln’s goal upon entering the Civil War.”

Really? Why was that? Because he didn’t want to get rid of slavery or because he felt that it was not in his power to do so? (It wasn’t. The Constitution had to be amended for slavery to be illegal in times of peace, and Lincoln supported these amendments strongly before he was murdered.)

+“Lincoln had stated numerous times that while he was against slavery in general, there would be too much opposition to force the issue.”

“To force the issue”? How about because he said he had no legal authority to do so (oh, that’s right he was a despot!)? And then he turned around and freed the slaves that he thought he could LEGALLY free (even though he was a tyrant).

He also argued effectively for full black suffrage while Booth watched in fury (even though emancipating was purely smoke and mirrors for political effect). If he was a tyrant then why did he not just free the slaves in the Northern slave states, even though you admitted he wanted to? HINT: he had no power to do so as President, but reasoned that as Commander in Chief, he could do as he pleased with captured or uncaptured enemy war materiel (slaves).

+“It’s ok, I understand that people revere the “Great Emancipator,” and it doesn’t matter how he trampled on the rights of his countrymen in the process.”

It’s ok, I understand there are people out there who like to say things like “We didn’t really land on the moon”, “Communism was a good idea”, “There are no heroes”, and “The Civil War had nothing to do with slavery,” too. You are just as wrong as they are.

You are right about one thing, though – Lincoln stole all my rights. I don’t have the right to a trial. I still have the right to forcibly secede as soon as it looks like I will not be able to control the government anymore. I am actually a slave writing this from a shack downriver.

Shit, that’s right. As Lincoln said as president, and as actually happened: “By the frame of the government under which we live, this same people have wisely given their public servants but little power for mischief; and have, with equal wisdom, provided for the return of that little to their own hands at very short intervals.”

How would you have won the war in his place? I know, you would not have arrested anyone or reacted forcefully to treason or brutal violence. Tell me how you would have dealt with the legislature of Baltimore in 1861, who wished to secede unlawfully. How would YOU have handled the tricky legal and moral issues surrounding Civil War? As well as Lincoln did?

Easy to criticize, easy to talk, hard to accomplish anything worthwhile. Write this on your mirror.

[quote]Cream wrote:
If he was a tyrant then why did he not just free the slaves in the Northern slave states, even though you admitted he wanted to? HINT: he had no power to do so as President, but reasoned that as Commander in Chief, he could do as he pleased with captured or uncaptured enemy war materiel (slaves).

+“It’s ok, I understand that people revere the “Great Emancipator,” and it doesn’t matter how he trampled on the rights of his countrymen in the process.”

It’s ok, I understand there are people out there who like to say things like “We didn’t really land on the moon”, “Communism was a good idea”, “There are no heroes”, and “The Civil War had nothing to do with slavery,” too. You are just as wrong as they are.

You are right about one thing, though – Lincoln stole all my rights. I don’t have the right to a trial. I still have the right to forcibly secede as soon as it looks like I will not be able to control the government anymore. I am actually a slave writing this from a shack downriver.

Shit, that’s right. As Lincoln said as president, and as actually happened: “By the frame of the government under which we live, this same people have wisely given their public servants but little power for mischief; and have, with equal wisdom, provided for the return of that little to their own hands at very short intervals.”

How would you have won the war in his place? I know, you would not have arrested anyone or reacted forcefully to treason or brutal violence. Tell me how you would have dealt with the legislature of Baltimore in 1861, who wished to secede unlawfully. How would YOU have handled the tricky legal and moral issues surrounding Civil War? As well as Lincoln did?

Easy to criticize, easy to talk, hard to accomplish anything worthwhile. Write this on your mirror.[/quote]

Not meaning to hijack the thread, but this is an excellent post! I like the Lincoln quote (of which I was unaware). Isn’t it amazing how brilliant Lincoln was, and how he basically did it himself?

BTW: Booth and his co-conspiritors were going to try to kidnap the president but were actually worried because he was ‘very athletic’. They were afraid he’d kick their asses!! Abe Lincoln – T-Man to the Max!!

Didn’t have the time to read all the replies. A friend forwarded me this great press release:

Press Release

For Release Monday, June 27 to New Hampshire media
For Release Tuesday, June 28 to all other media

Weare, New Hampshire (PRWEB) Could a hotel be built on the land owned by Supreme Court Justice David H. Souter? A new ruling by the Supreme Court which was supported by Justice Souter himself itself might allow it. A private developer is seeking to use this very law to build a hotel on Souter’s land.

Justice Souter’s vote in the “Kelo vs. City of New London” decision allows city governments to take land from one private owner and give it to another if the government will generate greater tax revenue or other economic benefits when the land is developed by the new owner.

On Monday June 27, Logan Darrow Clements, faxed a request to Chip Meany the code enforcement officer of the Towne of Weare, New Hampshire seeking to start the application process to build a hotel on 34 Cilley Hill Road. This is the present
location of Mr. Souter’s home.

Clements, CEO of Freestar Media, LLC, points out that the City of Weare will
certainly gain greater tax revenue and economic benefits with a hotel on 34
Cilley Hill Road than allowing Mr. Souter to own the land.

The proposed development, called “The Lost Liberty Hotel” will feature the “Just Desserts Cafe?” and include a museum, open to the public, featuring a permanent exhibit on the loss of freedom in America. Instead of a Gideon’s Bible each guest will receive a free copy of Ayn Rand’s novel “Atlas Shrugged.”

Clements indicated that the hotel must be built on this particular piece of land because it is a unique site being the home of someone largely responsible for destroying property rights for all Americans.

“This is not a prank” said Clements, “The Towne of Weare has five people on the Board of Selectmen. If three of them vote to use the power of eminent domain to take this land from Mr. Souter we can begin our hotel development.”

Clements’ plan is to raise investment capital from wealthy pro-liberty investors and draw up architectural plans. These plans would then be used to raise investment capital for the project. Clements hopes that regular customers of the hotel might include supporters of the Institute For Justice and participants in the Free State Project among others.

#

Logan Darrow Clements
Freestar Media, LLC