90% of Children with Down Syndrome are Aborted

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]Raw Finn wrote:

Actually no. I believe advancement in science could fix that person in the future. So said person could go on with one’s life when that happens.[/quote]

How incredibly kind of you.

And if similar advancement in science proves consciousness in fetuses prior to 13 weeks what will you do to resurrect all those lives who were put down back when you conjectured that a “good thing” was being done?[/quote]

I would not feel responsible for that. I have not killed fetuses, and won’t. I have my ideology based on the trust towards scientists. And I don’t think killing fetuses is a “good thing” but rather a neutral one. There are (should) be good reason for an abortion. I think a disability would be one, for instance.

Well I leave for a week and I am honestly surprised how many people get upset over the sharing of information shrug

Rather than pad my post number I will try to reply in one big message. If growing too large, I may have to be considerate and not reply to all. However if your ‘point’ needs to be addressed, bring it up again.

orion - understand downs before you judge them. Were you not taught how to read and write? 2) When is outright murder acceptable in your mind?

Schwarzfahrer - start your own thread, by all means!

TBG - Do you think the parent is nothing more than proud of the child? I am simply curious as to why this is exploitation?

HG - Not far off the point are we? shakes head 2) Their arguments are always the same and never change, all while their heads are buried really deep!

IC - thanks for placing words and the things I never said into my mouth. After you grow up and learn how to have an honest discussion we might move forward someday. You need to apologize because your head is buried so deep, in the sand, you cannot even form an argument. 2) Clearly define your stance please. 3) Are we a modern society or a group of people you can test “theories” on? 4) You “wouldn’t abort a child. Any child. It’s not the way ‘you are’ rigged. But, ‘you’ can objectively see why other people do and what purpose that serves” So that means as long as you understand a selfish choice, you wouldn’t say anything? 4) Learn what evolution is and then try to argue from the stance. 5) Do you believe you are more intelligent by being close minded? 5) Glad you can copy and paste, rather than have a collective thought of your own! 6) Understanding simple high school science will stop abortion. Nothing more, unless your head is buried so deep you cannot understand simple science. 7) So what is wrong about the crimes of today? 8) So post your level of education. I have a bachelor’s degree.

Sloth - Do you know how everyone will turn out before they are born? Babies don’t feel pain while being aborted do they?

DD - I agree with everything you post here as well :o ]

Mak - Please tell me what abortion is then.

Rohnyn - Except I know YOU a waste of resources simply because you think murder is the solution to the problems people face. Simple question, how many societies has that worked for, in the history of the world? 2) Who defines what is “rational or reasonable”? 3) Now you are jumping your ship to another which you think won’t. Stand up and defend your case. You look even more like a complete idiot when jumping from one argument to another. 4) Your arguments are getting completely weak! What defines “drooling fleshbags”? and how do you know that science will always be right? 5) Honesty is the best policy! It was 6 points, wasn’t? 6) Who asked you to support a downs child? No one, so keep your thinking to yourself.

DrSkeptix - Thank you for your clear and direct arguments. I hope to someday be as clear as you!

UL - Can we put this to a vote? Majority rule against one? Jaa jaa jaa

LF - Thanks for commenting and adding nothing to the thread! ; ) Have you healed up yet?

Florelius - Interesting because I can say that opinions are EXACTLY the same! 2) You need to understand the English language better before you try to tell others what they need to understand! 3) Why do only women matter? Does it not take a man to create a life?

jre67t - We agree on every point thus far!

kamui - Interesting video! My favorite one, out of many was â??When you think in categories, you underestimate how different two facts are, when they fall in the same category. When you think in categories you over-estimate how different they areâ?? Around the twenty minute mark. 2) Another point I agree with! Death is always wrong!

JEATON - You are a number that can be added to the number of people I know personally!

Chushin - You are too kind! ; )

FrozenNinja - No one knows but I know the road of abortion will lead to, without a doubt!

pat - No need to apologize for your speaking the truth ; ) 2) These morons no longer surprise me.

niksamaras - What would you do if the â??doctorsâ?? were wrong in regards to your healthy and normal child? 2) Can we take you out of the gene pool by cutting you spermaticords?

Cortes - Made me literally lol ; )

ephrem - When do you decided about the life you helped create? 2) Sorry, I have been busy with life and talking to people who are close minded can be rather frustrating. 3) What is magical about fifteen weeks? Let me guess, your government tells you so. That will lead somewhere promising. 4) Explain how they are different ephrem! 5) Science has yet to find a way to test this!

Raw Finn - A baby cannot be conscious until something like twelve weeks after being born. Should we kill a child after birth? 2) I was in a coma for six weeks. Guess how many Dr.'s thought I would wake from my severe traumatic brain injury? Not one! 3) What MIGHT happen in the future is pointless. Argue about the present. That much is known. 4) What event christens rights upon a person going down an eight inch canal? 5) “Morality is an opinion based thing.” Morality is something you lack. 6) At the moment of conception, people have all the exact same traits as any other person, save four. Size, level of development, environment and degree of dependency. Those traits can be used to define the differences between every person on the earth today AND used to define the differences of the unborn.

push - GOOD points thus far and again, I agree with all of your points on this thread.

[quote]kneedragger79 wrote:
Mak â?? Please tell me what abortion is then.[/quote]

Tell me what exploitation is then.

Is that a side step, again from you Mak? Please define your stance before you expect others to define their own.

[quote]Makavali wrote:
Tell me what exploitation is then.[/quote]

Just a request for clarification, I was keeping up with the thread for a little while before coming back to it now.

Kneedragger, when you said this:
Sloth - Do you know how everyone will turn out before they are born? Babies don’t feel pain while being aborted do they?

Than said this:

Raw Finn - 3) What MIGHT happen in the future is pointless. Argue about the present. That much is known.

Please don’t take this as an attack, it just seems like for the former with Sloth it’s argued that the basis of terminating a life that could have been against the life at present is at stake. But with Finn you say the opposite.

[quote]ephrem wrote:

Why would she do this? Unlikely scenarios like these don’t make your point Cortes.
[/quote]

Is that so?

Also keep in mind my point at present is 100% related to the original post and the slippery slope argument that arose from it.

First, we sanction the termination of unborn children who are genetically “flawed.”

Next, we arrive at the “uncomfortable” situation above.

After that? No, certainly it will never go any farther than it already has? Well, what if it does? At what point would you start to care? After your 15 or 21 or 24 week line has been crossed? Later? Around the point that genetically engineering your “perfect” child becomes a viable option and “imperfect” children are regarded as somewhat less than human, to be treated like dogs and slaves and jews?

Of course you don’t care. Like I said, you got no skin in the game. Yet.

dreds989 - Sorry for NOT being clear in this form of communication. My fault that my sarcasm is not being able to be picked up.

No one knows what the future will bring. However, every abortion in the history of the world, ends in death. Even if the abortion wasn’t successful and a child is still born, the aborted fetus is left on a table until they die!

Babies can feel pain, the actual truth is NOT known because Dr.'s find new ways to test when perceptions such as pain can be felt. If you watch an abortion via a sonogram, the fetus feels the instant of being touched by the cold forceps of death. Then as the child is torn apart limb from limb while alive, you can see the reactions! Imagine trying to get away from something that tears apart your body while in the only home you have ever known.

My apologies for not being clear. Plus I never take anything personal on the internet. I will admit when proven wrong though ; )

The future is NOT known, yet when life is no longer respected in ALL forms, the weakest stages of life are the first to go. Do you need examples?

[quote]dreads989 wrote:
Just a request for clarification, I was keeping up with the thread for a little while before coming back to it now.

Kneedragger, when you said this:
Sloth - Do you know how everyone will turn out before they are born? Babies don’t feel pain while being aborted do they?

Than said this:

Raw Finn - 3) What MIGHT happen in the future is pointless. Argue about the present. That much is known.

Please don’t take this as an attack, it just seems like for the former with Sloth it’s argued that the basis of terminating a life that could have been against the life at present is at stake. But with Finn you say the opposite.

[/quote]

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]Raw Finn wrote:

…But there is a difference because when a fetus gets aborted it has never lived or had people who would be devastated by the loss. Aborting a fetus and putting down a person who has a history in life are things that are far different from one another.

[/quote]

Ahhh…the plot thickens…
[/quote]

Cue squirming and word redefining in three…two…one…

[quote]Raw Finn wrote:
There are (should) be good reason for an abortion. I think a disability would be one, for instance.[/quote]

Good grief. Do you guys read your posts before hitting send? I highly recommend this. You know how, like, your voice sounds differently when you hear it recorded and played back?

Thanks for the reply! I didn’t want to assume you were being contradictory between the statements, and just wanted to understand where the sarcasm lies. I understand your points and direction your going in the thread, and while I appreciate the offer, the examples aren’t needed.

Carry on!


No one knows what the future will bring. However, every abortion in the history of the world, ends in death. Even if the abortion wasn’t successful and a child is still born, the aborted fetus is left on a table until they die!

Babies can feel pain, the actual truth is NOT known because Dr.'s find new ways to test when perceptions such as pain can be felt. If you watch an abortion via a sonogram, the fetus feels the instant of being touched by the cold forceps of death. Then as the child is torn apart limb from limb while alive, you can see the reactions! Imagine trying to get away from something that tears apart your body while in the only home you have ever known.

My apologies for not being clear. Plus I never take anything personal on the internet. I will admit when proven wrong though ; )

The future is NOT known, yet when life is no longer respected in ALL forms, the weakest stages of life are the first to go. Do you need examples?

You are welcome and thank you in return! May I ask where your stance lies and the reasons?

[quote]dreads989 wrote:
Thanks for the reply! I didn’t want to assume you were being contradictory between the statements, and just wanted to understand where the sarcasm lies. I understand your points and direction your going in the thread, and while I appreciate the offer, the examples aren’t needed.

Carry on! [/quote]

[quote]kneedragger79 wrote:

orion - understand downs before you judge them. Were you not taught how to read and write? 2) When is outright murder acceptable in your mind?

[/quote]

Well, if you venture in the territory of loaded questions you could at least have thrown one or two “innocents” in there.

<— iz disappoint

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]ephrem wrote:

Why would she do this? Unlikely scenarios like these don’t make your point Cortes.
[/quote]

Is that so?

Also keep in mind my point at present is 100% related to the original post and the slippery slope argument that arose from it.

First, we sanction the termination of unborn children who are genetically “flawed.”

Next, we arrive at the “uncomfortable” situation above.

After that? No, certainly it will never go any farther than it already has? Well, what if it does? At what point would you start to care? After your 15 or 21 or 24 week line has been crossed? Later? Around the point that genetically engineering your “perfect” child becomes a viable option and “imperfect” children are regarded as somewhat less than human, to be treated like dogs and slaves and jews?

Of course you don’t care. Like I said, you got no skin in the game. Yet.
[/quote]

What if it doesn’t? What if when the majority of people keep a level head about it and won’t abuse technology? Are you really willing to deny half the world’s population a choice and say in the matter on the off-chance a stupid person makes a stupid choice?

Think about it. Would you really rather make a woman a secondclass citizen?

[quote]ephrem wrote:
If you define a 15-week old zygote as equal to a 39 week old unborn baby you’d have trouble understanding my position.

To me they are not equal, and yes we’ve been over this countless times.[/quote]

I have trouble with the concept of neuro-physiological development as the definition of humanness. That part cannot happen with out all the parts before it. I don’t see how that’s the magical turning point. It simply resembling more closely to what you think a human should be, isn’t the definition of a person. All the properties of that person are already their and simply awaiting development; but then again, so is a new born.

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]Raw Finn wrote:

…I have my ideology based on the trust towards scientists…

[/quote]

Salient point.

A very sad, sad commentary on how some folks formulate the foundations of their ideology.
[/quote]

That’s fine because the growing consensus among scientists are agreeing that in utero life is human life…It’s kinda tough to deny. It’s not a lizard.